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Is noon 12am or 12 pm ?

Is noon 12am or 12 pm ?

6
votes

Noon = 12PM. Midnight = 12AM. or vice-versa?

Have I had it wrong all my life grin confused

14881 views
updated Aug 31, 2011
edited by ian-hill
posted by ian-hill
Noon and midnight I get but I never know how to set the clocks when daylight savings times begins or ends! - LaBurra, Aug 25, 2011
fall back/spring forward ;) - toothpastechica, Aug 25, 2011
Yeah, I know the formula but I always get it wrong - fall back means set it an hour earlier to me, and that is backwards. - LaBurra, Aug 25, 2011
autumn = "fall" (in the USA) - when the leaves fall off the trees.- that is when the clocks are put back an hour.. - ian-hill, Aug 25, 2011
"vice versa" - samdie, Aug 26, 2011
I once stopped to think about the same thing. Such a simple matter yet, look at how many answers you got. Wow, :) - EL_MAG0, Aug 27, 2011
Noon = midday 12 pm - Ace_Poppins, Aug 27, 2011
If the minute after noon = 00:01 pm - and the minute before noon = 11:59am how can the minute in between be 12:00 PM? - ian-hill, Aug 27, 2011

25 Answers

4
votes

Ian, I have always thought that noon & midnight are very similar to the theoretical zero year, which we know never occurred...it went from 1 BC to 1 AD (correct me if I am wrong!)... so it's either 12:00 noon or 12:00 midnight, but not AM nor PM... one second later and it's AM or PM respectively, but at high noon and the witching hour, it is neither... simply noon and midnight....


Anyone else onboard? red face

updated Aug 27, 2011
posted by cristalino
See: http://www.nmm.ac.uk/explore/astronomy-and-time/time-facts/faqs/is-noon-12-am-or-12-pm - cristalino, Aug 25, 2011
I'm onboard. Is that a reference to Lorenzo's comment on time zones and trains? :-) - 0074b507, Aug 26, 2011
Chris do you know about " Denis the short" the monk who started the calendar at "zero". - pacofinkler, Aug 26, 2011
@Paco: You mean Dionysius Exiguus? I know he was credited with coming up with Anno Domini or something like that... can you give me a link? :) - cristalino, Aug 27, 2011
6
votes

Let's look at the Latin involved: a.m. is ante (before) meridiem and p.m. is post (after) meridiem. So the question becomes:

what is meridiem? meridiem=noon (midday, literally)

So a.m. is before noon and p.m. is past noon.

What is noon?

The time or point in the sun's path at which the sun is on the local meridian. Also called noontide, noontime.

As you may recall the sun travels from east (rises) to west (sets). Meridian miles are those longitudal lines that run from the North to South poles. So when the sun intersects the meridian line passing through that location it is noon at that location. A layman's description is more commonly stated as when the sun is directly overhead.

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updated Aug 27, 2011
edited by 0074b507
posted by 0074b507
So Quentin - We should N E V E R ever say 12am or 12 PM for noon - neither can be "correct" right? - ian-hill, Aug 25, 2011
Absolutely correct! :) - cristalino, Aug 25, 2011
Technically correct, but they are often called 12 p.m. (noon) and midnight is called 12 a.m. midnight can also be considered either p.m. or a.m., but traditional rules - 0074b507, Aug 25, 2011
midnight could be seen as either 12 hrs before or after noon. 11:59 pm- midnight- 0:01 a.m. - 0074b507, Aug 25, 2011
You should say 12 midnight or 12 o'clock noon and not use a.m. or pm. but we arbitrarily do. - 0074b507, Aug 25, 2011
This defintion was replaced with time zones so trains would run on time. - lorenzo9, Aug 26, 2011
Times zones are irregular in that they deviate around populated areas and the international date line isn't the 0° prime meridian. - 0074b507, Aug 26, 2011
4
votes

00:00 is 12am or 12midnight (not midday) this is when a new day starts and half of the night has elapsed.

12:00 is 12pm or 12 noon (midday) when 12 hours of the 24-hour day have elapsed.

updated Aug 31, 2011
edited by SpanishPal
posted by SpanishPal
Nice conceptualization. - 0074b507, Aug 31, 2011
4
votes

Ian I love it!!! Personally I was brought up to believe that 12AM was way too late for kids to be up so that should answer that question but it is a real good mind teaser.

updated Aug 28, 2011
posted by Yeser007
I always thought it was too late for them to stay in bed :) - ian-hill, Aug 28, 2011
4
votes

This is why timecards and airports use the 24 hour clock!!

updated Aug 27, 2011
posted by toothpastechica
I agree. Let's do away with the 12 hour clock when we do away with the English system of measurement and go metric. - 0074b507, Aug 26, 2011
Q, you got Congress in your pocket or what? jeje America is taking the American system all the way to the grave! :) - cristalino, Aug 27, 2011
3
votes

I found this argument searching a little bit:

"Another way of knowing that 12 noon can not be 12:00 am is that 12:00 am can not be followed one minute later by 12:01 pm. "

It makes sense to me, but I also found a lot of people saying that there is not an "official" definition of this.

So, to avoid confusion, I would use 12:00 noon and 12:00 midnight.

updated Aug 31, 2011
posted by 00e657d4
2
votes

In the USA the convention is that noon is 12PM and midnight is 12AM.

Of course this can be endlessly argued. The legal profession has generally taken a conservative position when writing effective dates for contracts and law. They usually specify something like "12:01am" or "11:59pm", so there can be no attempt at misinterpretation. smile

updated Aug 31, 2011
posted by pesta
2
votes

Well, I have always come alive around 12AM, but have always known it to be midnight. So to answer your question, 12AM is the beginning of a brand new day and 12PM is the middle of the day or noon. smile

updated Aug 31, 2011
posted by Nicole-B
2
votes

This is funny: my American proofreader has once corrected 12 pm and replaced it with 12 noon to avoid the misunderstanding discussed here.

updated Aug 26, 2011
posted by bomberapolaca
1
vote

It would appear that I am just as correct saying noon = 12am as those who say it is 12pm

Perhaps on a philosophical level, but seeing as how all 12-hour digital clocks and watches as well as--as others pointed out--12-hour clocks on computers and store "hours" signs and etc use the convention of 12PM for noon and 12AM for midnight, I feel that on a practical level it is correct to say 12PM = noon and 12AM = midnight (since it is such a widely used convention).

Eso es mi "dos centavos," al menos. =)

updated Aug 31, 2011
posted by webdunce
Your "2 cents worth" accepted webdunce -but changing the habit of a lifetime can be difficult. :) - ian-hill, Aug 31, 2011
Agreed!!! :) - webdunce, Aug 31, 2011
1
vote

In my head I will still believe that 12.00am should come 1 minute after 11.59am

That puts you on a very slippery slope. If that is your position, how can you argue against 2 minutes after 12:00 am being anything other than "12:02 am"? The system is, fundamentally, arbitrary.

One could, of course, speak of several billion minutes (or whatever) after the flood (as described in the Epic of Gilgamesh) but that doesn't really resolve the problem of before/after some arbitrary point in time..

updated Aug 31, 2011
posted by samdie
I can because we move into PM A F T E R we pass noon so 2 minutes past noon = 00:02pm (the first 2 minutes of PM) - ian-hill, Aug 26, 2011
1
vote

In my head I will still believe that 12.00am should come 1 minute after 11.59am

That puts you on a very slippery slope. If that is your position, how can you argue against 2 minutes after 12:00 am being anything other than "12:02 am"? The system is, fundamentally, arbitrary.

One could, of course, speak of several billion minutes (or whatever) after the flood (as described in the Epic of Gilgamesh) but that doesn't really resolve the problem of before/after some arbitrary point in time..

updated Aug 31, 2011
posted by samdie
1
vote

Well, I temporarily set my computer clock to 11:59 pm. This would obviously be in the evening, 1 minute away from midnight.

I then watched it and right at 12:00:00 it also changed to AM.

Therefore, according to Windows, midnight is 12:00 AM.

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updated Aug 27, 2011
posted by Tosh
My MS clock is a 24 hour clock and does not use am or pm ??? - ian-hill, Aug 26, 2011
Do you use a 12 hour clock? - ian-hill, Aug 26, 2011
Yes, at home I do. At work, we use a 24-hour clock. - Tosh, Aug 26, 2011
And we all march to the "Windows" drumbeat? I for one will be turning in my "lemming" card very soon if that's the case! jeje - cristalino, Aug 27, 2011
Interesting. :) - EL_MAG0, Aug 27, 2011
1
vote

I have used the 24 hour clock for so long I hardly think in AM or PM at all. if I have a meeting at three it is 1500, if it is at 9:30, it is 0930. Because of my work I have had to manage time zones from Europe to Asia and this was the most practical way to do it. My cell phone,computer and clocks are all on the 24 hour clock. So for me 1200 is noon and 0000 is midnight.Easy! It therefore is little wonder that I cannot tell time in the Spanish way.

updated Aug 27, 2011
posted by pacofinkler
I thought they used 24 hr. clocks in Mexico.. ? - EL_MAG0, Aug 27, 2011
1
vote

Well - I have always thought of 12am as noon.

How many others have thought the same?

I know we can say 12 noon and 12 midnight - but do we really have to?

updated Aug 26, 2011
posted by ian-hill
No, just say "noon" and "midnight"... the 12 o'clock is understood, I would think! :) - cristalino, Aug 26, 2011