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"gerund" vs. "gerundio" (Misuse of terms on SD)

"gerund" vs. "gerundio" (Misuse of terms on SD)

5
votes

Despite the label used in the conjugation tables, the Spanish verb forms that end in -ando, -iendo are not gerunds. In Spanish they are called "gerundios". The terms "gerund" and "gerundio" obviously are related etymologically but neither is a translation for the other.

In English a "gerund" is a verbal noun. i.e. "Walking is good exercise." However in the sentence "I am walking to the store." or "The man walking in the street ..." 'walking' is not a gerund; it is a present participle (used to form progressive/continuous tenses or as an adjective). Thus, it is incorrect that the verb form ending in '-ing' is a gerund (one should, instead, say can be used as a gerund [form != function]).

The R.A.E. says of 'gerundio': "Forma invariable no personal del verbo, cuya terminación regular, en español, es -ando en los verbos de la primera conjugación, -iendo o -yendo en los de la segunda y tercera." and goes on to say: "Tiene más generalmente carácter adverbial, y puede expresar modo, condición, tiempo, motivo, concesión y otras circunstancias."

In Spanish the only verbal form that can be used as a noun (thereby fulfilling the English definition of a 'gerund') is the infinitive.

The terms that should be used in the conjugation tables (if the entries are to be labeled in English) are 'present participle' and 'past participle'. Conversely the entries could be labeled with the Spanish grammatical terms.

5260 views
updated Jun 10, 2010
posted by samdie
me merece un voto;) - 00494d19, May 17, 2010

8 Answers

3
votes

@ Marianne

What is a present participle?

A verb form with an "-ing" ending (for example, "tapping").

What is the present progressive ?

A form of the verb "to be" PLUS a present participle (for example, "is tapping").

The Difference Between the Present Progressive and Present Participle?

Both have the same "-ing" ending, but a present participle alone can't stand as the main verb of a sentence (unaccompanied by a form of the verb "to be").

For example, "John, tapping his leg to the music" is incomplete.

A verb in the present progressive may itself serve as the predicate of a sentence:

For example "John is tapping his leg to the music."

The present progressive is used for ongoing actions--that is, for actions occurring at the moment of speaking and for actions that take place for a short period of time.

updated Jun 10, 2010
posted by Kiwi-Girl
Thank you! - --Mariana--, May 17, 2010
2
votes

In English, the gerund is identical in form to the present participle (ending in -ing) and can behave as a verb within a clause (so that it may be modified by an adverb or have an object), but the clause as a whole (sometimes consisting of only one word, the gerund itself) acts as a noun within the larger sentence.

In some ways the usual terminology does not make enough distinctions. On the other hand, many would say that grammatical terminology over-complicates things. My personal preference is to use the term 'present participle' to refer to the form of the word (derived from a verb and ending in '-ing') and to its use as an adjective.

I am tempted to refer to the use (in English) of the infinitive as a noun (in most cases, one can use, indifferently, the infinitive or the present participle as a noun) a a 'gerund' (thus placing all of the focus on the function). Basically this results from reasoning backwards from the notion of "verbal noun". In English (in most cases) one can use either the infinitive or the present participle as a noun (in Spanish, only the infinitive). However, from what I've read, many grammarians do not refer to the infinitive used as a noun as a 'gerund' (maybe they really are trying to complicate things).

updated May 17, 2010
posted by samdie
1
vote

Mmmm very interesting

Just to add a little more here's a quote from Wikipedia - under the heading Gerund

In English, the gerund is identical in form to the present participle (ending in -ing) and can behave as a verb within a clause (so that it may be modified by an adverb or have an object), but the clause as a whole (sometimes consisting of only one word, the gerund itself) acts as a noun within the larger sentence. For example: Editing this article is easy.

Some use "gerund" to refer to all nouns ending in -ing, but in more careful use, not all nouns ending in -ing are gerunds.[1] The formal distinction is that a gerund is a verbal noun – a noun derived from a verb that retains verb characteristics, that functions simultaneously as a noun and a verb, while other nouns ending in -ing are deverbal nouns, which function as common nouns, not as verbs at all. Compare: I like fencing. (gerund, an activity, could be replaced with "to fence") The white fencing adds to the character of the neighborhood. (deverbal, could be replaced with an object such as "bench") [edit]

updated May 17, 2010
posted by Kiwi-Girl
Exactly. - samdie, May 17, 2010
0
votes

Thank you for this. It clarifies things for the most part, but I still have a question about the gerundio and if I have used it correctly. I often text my boyfriend en español. For example, I will ask: ¿Trabajando duro? Working hard? His answer: Siempre. Always Obviously he understood me, but I am wondering if this is proper use of the gerundio. Gracias grin

updated May 18, 2010
posted by chica_rica
It's really a "chopped down" version of "¿Estás trabajando duro?" (grammatically, incomplete). - samdie, May 18, 2010
The English is also a colloquial form of "Are you working hard?" (grammatically, incomplete) - samdie, May 18, 2010
0
votes

So, in English, we only call the present participle a gerund when it's used as a noun? As in: "Walking is the best." "Crying is for girls." "Dancing is not fun."

updated May 17, 2010
posted by Perry-Bleiberg
One could, I suppose, say "the present participle used as a gerund" but that's somewhat cumbersome. - samdie, May 17, 2010
But then, what are examples of words that can be used as gerunds but not present participles? - Perry-Bleiberg, May 17, 2010
Most infinitives. e.g. "I like to walk." - samdie, May 17, 2010
*Aha moment occurs* Thank you very much! - Perry-Bleiberg, May 17, 2010
0
votes

Aplausos!!!

No podría haber sido explicado mejor!!!

updated May 17, 2010
posted by Benz
0
votes

But then, what are examples of words that can be used as gerunds but not present participles? - Perry-Bleibe

From the theoretical point of view, any infinitive. In practice, in English, it depends on the verb (I.e. it is not a question of grammar but of usage/preference). However, this response depends on the acceptance of the use of the term 'gerund' to encompass "infinitives used as nouns".

Obviously if one defines a gerund as being "a present participle used as a noun", then anything that is not a 'present participle' is automatically excluded. If, on the other hand, one accepts "a verbal form used as a noun" then the range of possibilities is broadened (because infinitives can also be used as nouns).

updated May 17, 2010
posted by samdie
0
votes

..."The man walking in the street ..." walking' is not a gerund; it is a present participle..

Thank you, Samdie. I've been confused by these terms before!!

I've felt forced (by others' constant use of the word) to use the word "gerund" when what I really wanted to say was "present participle."

Can I use the term "present progressive" to describe the "present participle" or do they have different meanings?

updated May 17, 2010
posted by --Mariana--
It becomes 'present progressive' when accompanied by a helping verb. - samdie, May 17, 2010
'present progressive' really descrives the combination. - samdie, May 17, 2010
So, "I have been walking for three days" is the "present progressive?" - --Mariana--, May 17, 2010
present progressive - I am walking; progressive form of the present progressive - I have been walking... - Izanoni1, May 17, 2010
Not quite sure what Izanoni is getteing at. "I have been walking ..." = present perfect progressive. - samdie, May 17, 2010
Sorry...typo: "progressive form of the present perfect" not "progressive form of the present progressive" - Izanoni1, May 17, 2010