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The subjunctive in English

The subjunctive in English

4
votes

There seems to be a lot of confusion about the use of the subjunctive mood in English, even among native speakers, so I'm going to give a few examples where it is and is not required. I'm going to restrict myself to the cases of statements contrary to fact and sentences with if clauses.

Before Columbus, many people thought the Earth was flat.

Even though the Earth is not flat, many people did think that it was, so the use of the subjunctive would be incorrect here.

If the Earth were flat, the oceans would drain over the edges.

This sentence has an if clause with a contrary to fact statement, so it uses the subjunctive, and the conditional is used in the consequent clause. This is an example of a "conditional 2" sentence. As you might guess from the "2", there are other conditionals with if clauses that don't use the subjunctive.

If you don't eat, you get hungry.--conditional 0 (corrected)

If she left at 10:15, she'll be here by 1:30.--conditional 1

Now consider the following counterfactual sentence:

If I bought a new car, people would think I was rich.

I didn't buy a new car, so bought is in the subjunctive. In the consequent clause, would makes think conditional and was is conjugated according to the normal sequence of tenses "would. . .was"/"will. . .am". Even though I am not rich, the subjunctive is not used here.

In the flow of a conversation, some clauses are implied by context and so omitted from the sentence. In a conversation where me buying a new car had just been raised, the if clause could be omitted and the sentence shortened to:

People would think I was rich.

It is still a conditional and uses the sequence of tenses accordingly, just as if the if clause had been spoken. Even though I am not rich, the subjunctive is still not used.

3412 views
updated Feb 26, 2011
edited by lorenzo9
posted by lorenzo9
A classic use of subjunctive is "If I were rich I'd buy a Rolls Royce." Many people say "If I was..." Eeeeeek! ;-) - gableslizard, Nov 30, 2010
"If you don't eat, you'll get hungry.--conditional 0" (This is Conditional#1) ......." If she left at 10:15, she'll be here by 1:30.--conditional 1" ....... (This is Conditional #2 and should be "If she were to leave") ..... "Conditional 0 doesn't exist - 005faa61, Nov 30, 2010
Zero conditional does exist !!! "Water boils if you heat it to 100c" 2 simple present tense verbs = a Zero Conditional. - ian-hill, Nov 30, 2010
After any Modal the next verb must be a "base verb" = infinitive minus the "to" - ian-hill, Nov 30, 2010
Ian, your example is Conditional #1. "If you heat it" is a conditional phrase, so why would it be called Zero Conditional? This makes no sense - 005faa61, Nov 30, 2010
We are talking of conditionals and Zero conditionals do exist. - ian-hill, Nov 30, 2010
This is a 1st Conditional "If we take John, he'll be really pleased" - Simple present verb + a simple future verb. - ian-hill, Nov 30, 2010
Go learn the conditionals Julian - the 2nd and 3rd ones as well - ian-hill, Nov 30, 2010

11 Answers

3
votes

This is not my work but if it were I would be proud of it.

The present subjunctive has three uses in modern English.

First, it follows verbs, nouns or adjectives that express the idea of command, suggestion or possibility: I suggested that he leave; It is my recommendation that she not be appointed; It is fitting that she resign. This use of the present subjunctive is common in American English. In British English it is more usual to use should: I suggested that he should leave, but it seems that the present subjunctive may be on the increase.

Second, it is used in formal English in clauses beginning with words such as if; although; whether and lest: If that be the case, there is little more we can do; Tie her up securely, lest she escape. This use of the present subjunctive tends to sound stilted and old-fashioned, and in everyday speech and writing the indicative is usually used instead: If that is the case..., but again American English uses it more readily than British English.

Third, it is used in certain fixed phrases, such as far be it from me; be that as it may; God save the Queen; come what may; suffice it to say; heaven forbid; perish the thought.

The past subjunctive effectively relates only to the verb to be, where it takes the form were. It is used to express hypothetical states, and comes after the verbs wish and suppose, conjunctions such as if; if only; as; though; whether, and the phrases would rather and would that: I wish she were here; If I were you, I'd resign; Would that he were still alive. It is widely used in everyday English, but in non-formal contexts it is often replaced by was in the first and third person singular: I wish she was here. In formal or literary English, the order of if-clauses can be reversed and the if omitted: Were I you, I'd resign.

Whatever - it is much simpler than the Spanish subjunctive.

updated Dec 1, 2010
edited by ian-hill
posted by ian-hill
Thanks Ian. That's very clear! - cogumela, Nov 30, 2010
Maybe simpler, but still not easy for a native of Spanish, and we don't have problems with our subjunctive. - lazarus1907, Nov 30, 2010
You don't Lazarus but I do. - ian-hill, Nov 30, 2010
2
votes

The past subjunctive effectively relates only to the verb to be, where it takes the form were.

It might have been more accurate (at least in my opinion), had the author simply suggested instead that the past subjunctive and past indicative were morphologically identical in all cases (with the exception of the verb "to be").

This assertion should not be interpreted to mean, however, that the past indicative and the past subjunctive perform identical semantic roles within a sentence. Despite the morphological overlap, each plays its distinct role within a sentence.

To state a condition or wish that is contrary to present requires the use of the past subjunctive—for any verb. For example, the following set of sentences contrasts the differences in usage between the past subjunctive, present indicative and past indicative, respectively. In each of the following instances both the past subjunctive and the present indicative are used for present conditions; meanwhile, the past indicative is used to describe factual events that occurred in the past:

Subjunctive Present Indicative Past Indicative
Used to state a condition or event that is contrary to fact that occurs in the present Used to make a declaration or statement of actuality that occurs in the present Used to make a declaration or statement of actuality about an event that occurs in the past
I would be an A student if only I studied hard/had study habits like my brother. I am an A student because I study hard like my brother I was/used to be an A student when I studied hard like my brother
I would be really cool, if only I had a car I am really cool because I have a car. I was really cool when I had a car.
I wish I owned a car, then I would be cool I own a car, so I am cool. I owned a car, and that made me cool.
I wish that I lived in Florida so that I might be able to go to the beach. I live in Florida, so I go to the beach everyday. When I lived in Florida I went to the beach every day.
I wish that I had a million dollars so that I could buy anything that I pleased. I have a million dollars, so I buy anything that I please. When I had a million dollars, I bought anything that I pleased.
If I had a million dollars I would buy anything that I wanted. I have a million dollars, and/so I buy anything that I want. When I had a million dollars, I bought anything that I wanted.
- - -
updated Dec 2, 2010
edited by Izanoni1
posted by Izanoni1
1
vote

There seems to be a lot of confusion about the use of the subjunctive mood in English, even among native speakers,

Can't argue with that.

If I bought a new car, people would think I was rich.

Large numbers of people would use that exact phrasing. I (since am not rich) I would uses "were".

In my view, this "dumbing down " of the language only means that nuances of language can no longer be expressed. When the differences no longer "make a difference" we are reduced to the level of sitcom dialogue.

updated Dec 2, 2010
posted by samdie
Your usage of "were" would be grammatically incorrect. Even though it is not true, people would think it, so it is incorrect to use the subjunctive here. - lorenzo9, Dec 2, 2010
1
vote

The past subjunctive effectively relates only to the verb to be, where it takes the form were. It is used to express hypothetical states, and comes after the verbs wish and suppose, conjunctions such as if; if only; as; though; whether, and the phrases would rather and would that: I wish she were here;

This is the case in my thread :

you would think ...is a hypothetical state , equal to : as if I were.....

You would think I were rich....as though, as if I were rich.

Lorenzo said in that thread it was not correct, I don't agree.

updated Dec 1, 2010
posted by 00494d19
The contrary fact element is having a new car, not that people would think you were rich if you did. - lorenzo9, Dec 1, 2010
1
vote

Suppose that one were to start a thread on the subjunctive . . .

updated Dec 1, 2010
posted by 008f2974
1
vote

If I bought a new car, people would think I was rich.

This is the type of structure that makes learning English as a second language very difficult.

There are two past-tense words here that at one time would have been considered incorrect conjugation while today they are unfortunately considered "accepted usage" - even by Oxford..

The sentence should be in Conditional #2: If I were to buy a new car, people would think I am rich.

(Because Conditional #2 reflects hypothetical in the present, I am is correct with would showing hypothesis in the second phrase).

updated Dec 1, 2010
posted by 005faa61
Bought is actually in the subjunctive, which happens to be the same word as te past tense, as it is for most verbs. The sequence of tenses for conditional clauses is "would. . .was", "would. . .am" is an incorrect mixing of tenses within a clause. - lorenzo9, Nov 30, 2010
"Bought" is past tense of "Buy." I think you may be confusing Cases with Tenses. Conditional is a case and therefore doesn't conjugate verbs; it uses auxilaries. And as previously mentioned, there is a lot of "accepted" stuff in English today - 005faa61, Nov 30, 2010
Read Izanoni1's post in this thread. - lorenzo9, Dec 1, 2010
0
votes

Hola Julian:

Conditional #2 (hypothetical in present)

If it were to rain, the children would sing.

There is nothing wrong with this statement. I just want to tag something on to avoid any confusion. In the protasis (condition clause) of a second conditional, the proposition often refers to a current state known to be false/improbable or is presented as extremely unlikely. However, the second conditional can be used to refer to future states as well.

updated Dec 2, 2010
posted by Izanoni1
Ira, I agree - and good point - but I thought we were beyond the basics here. However for the benefit of those who may possibly not know, Present Tense can be used to mean Future Tense (but it's still present tense structure) cont: - 005faa61, Dec 1, 2010
Cont: We can do this in Indictative, Subjuntive, Passive or Active Voice, but the tense remains Present, regardless of the meaning - 005faa61, Dec 1, 2010
"were" is past tense - "sing" is preceded by a modal so cannot be said to be "present" - ian-hill, Dec 2, 2010
0
votes

There seems to be a difference in nomenclature of grammar between the UK and the Americas - about which we can all argue and never get anywhere as we place phrases under a microscope and examine them - so here is a very simple example of the usages of all 3 conditionals used, at least, in the Americas.

Conditional #1 (real occurances in present or future)

If it rains, the children sing.

When it rains, the children will sing.

If it rains, the children will sing.

Conditional #2 (hypothetical in present)

If it were to rain, the children would sing.

Conditional #3 (hypothetical in past)

If it had rained, the children would have sung.

updated Dec 2, 2010
posted by 005faa61
Your 1st one above is a Zero conditional Julian - ian-hill, Dec 2, 2010
0
votes

Ok one more time.

Zero conditionals DO exist.

As do Mixed conditionals.

updated Dec 2, 2010
posted by ian-hill
0
votes

If I were King of the Forest , not queen, not duke, not prince, my regal robes of the forest would be satin, not cotton, not chintz. grin

updated Dec 1, 2010
edited by athegr8
posted by athegr8
0
votes

This is very interesting, as subjunctive in English is not exactly one of the things that are easier to identify for a non native, and I'm sure I use it wrong at times.

Speaking of which, am I correct in believing that in these sentences subjunctive is not the correct case, or am I wrong here?

  • If I was too strict with you before, I apologize
  • If I was successful in the past, I don't see why I shouldn't be successful this time
updated Dec 1, 2010
edited by bill1111
posted by bill1111
Is the first sentence in subjunctive mood ??? Hmm... this is too difficult for me :( - cogumela, Nov 30, 2010
Well that's the point.. 'I was' is not subjunctive, I just wanted to confirm that they shouldn't be. - bill1111, Nov 30, 2010
Both are correct and neither should be subjunctive. The second could use since in place of if. - lorenzo9, Dec 1, 2010