me dueles ?
Gurus
As much as I love this song its giving me a headache grammatically speaking.
First I simply assumed it means "You hurt me" and it seemed to make perfect sense. Then my Spanish buddy throws me off again by saying "No it's Me Duele !" I told him the song was called "Me Dueles" but he insists that's not correct.
According to him the verb "doler" is used to say "I'm hurting" or "I'm hurt" or "My arm hurts" and so forth. Me duele el brazo.
I asked him how to say "You hurt me" and he said "Me lastimas" for example.
What bugs me tremendously is that a band from Spain such as La Quinta would sing something totally wrong ? I mean they must know right ? What does "Me dueles" sound like to a native speaker ?
Assuming it really is wrong then how would I know ? I can't find anything in the dictionary that shows me that the word "doler" cannot be used to hurt someone else. The only hint I guess I have is that it has no examples in there saying "You hurt me" but then again a dictionary cannot mention every single way a word is used. I probably have to learn how to read a dictionary better.
Any feedback is appreciated !
Thanks
71 Answers
Maybe we oughta dig a bit deeper ?
Me dueles como duele el tiempo, que yo he tirado a tu lado, me dueles como duelen los ojos, de haberte llorado tanto.
I cannot to save my live get this into proper English - even in a poetic way.
Is she comparing the pain to other things that also cause her pain - like time, eyes ? Huh ? Her eyes are hurting all the time and she is saying that thinking of him hurts her as much as that ? Why are her eyes always hurting ? Or are they're hurting from all the crying because of him but that would be a game of chicken-and-egg wouldn't it ? Why is time hurting ?
I also just realized something else. Aren't you supposed to use verbs reflexively when referring to body parts because you're supposed to refer to those only with definite article like this :
Me lavo las manos - I myself wash the hands - I wash my hands.
Then again dolerse means to grieve so I guess that wouldn't make much sense either.
Soo many questions...
doler.
(Del lat. dol?re).
intr. Dicho de una parte del cuerpo: Padecer dolor, mediante causa interior o exterior. Doler la cabeza, los ojos, las manos.
intr. Dicho de una cosa: Causar pesar o aversión. Le dolió la incomprensión de la gente.
Now, what that seems to indicate is that the verb can mean "to cause physical pain" when referring to a body part (or the body in general at times). Otherwise, when referring to non-body-part things, it can only be used to mean to cause grief or aversion.
So, me deules could only be used to refer to you causing me mental anguish (you abandoned me or whatever) and not physical pain (you stood on my foot).
However, based on others' comments, I get the impression that really the second meaning is generally restricted to things and not people (except figuratively).
me dueles = you hurt me me dueles = you make me feel pain
Most of the answers are on the right path. it´s grammatically correct, but it´s a poetic use of the expression, so it does not follow the general rules.
In the same lyrical line, but in English, Rick Springfield sings.
...but nobody I've ever loved ever hurt me like you did With that lack of feelin'
I've got a hole in my heart You know that I've got a hole in my heart But I won't beg, oh baby I won't beg anymore
You're nothing but a taker A real heartbreaker Who ever hurt you so long ago must have been a master But you're learning fast
I've got a hole in my heart You know that I've got a hole in my heart But I won't beg, oh baby I won't beg anymore
Nobody I've ever loved ever hurt me like you did With that lack of feelin'
I've got a hole in my heart You know that I've got a hole in my heart But I won't beg, oh baby I won't beg anymore I've got a hole in my heart I've got a hole in my heart I've got a hole in my heart
Does he really have a hole in his heart?? he´ll be dead!
So I went I picked up THE ONE book that is full of **** ? I'm gonna check again when I go home.
ese comentario me dolió
Which, if one knows from context that the comment was the subject, that could easily be shortened to me dolió, which really seems to indicate "me dueles" is also fine -- grammatically speaking.
Just for the record, I thought we ought to have the Real Academia Español entry here, too. So I looked up "doler" at www.rae.es:
Notice that the second entry is "causar pesar o aversión" is nonetheless marked "intr" and the pronoun is "le", not "lo" or "la" !!
doler.
(Del lat. dol?re).
intr. Dicho de una parte del cuerpo: Padecer dolor, mediante causa interior o exterior. Doler la cabeza, los ojos, las manos.
intr. Dicho de una cosa: Causar pesar o aversión. Le dolió la incomprensión de la gente.
Then the pronominal uses are listed:
prnl. Arrepentirse de haber hecho algo y tomar pesar de ello.
prnl. Dicho de una persona: Sentir pesar de no poder hacer lo que quisiera, o de un defecto natural, aunque no sea por culpa suya ni esté en su mano remediarlo.
prnl. Compadecerse del mal que alguien padece.
prnl. Quejarse y explicar el dolor.
I've got a hole in my heart
I understand metaphorical usage. One can literally have a hole in one's heart. It's a condition you can be born with and it can be repaired, but at the emotional level it means "I'm in great emotional pain." But, grammatically, the sentence is fine either way.
Now, people rarely go around saying "I've got a hole in my heart" and I can understand if people rarely say "me dueles" except in poetry. In fact, if one googles duele, one finds most hits are about feeling sick or having some body part aching.
But, what about if you are standing on my foot and I want to say, "Ow, you're hurting my foot?" (I'm just curious about that one, now).
Could one say: "¡Au, a mi pie le dueles!"
mediterrunio
I don't see how your example related to this. Sure he doesn't really have a whole in his heart but there is nothing wrong with this sentence grammatically ! Its 100% correct.
Aren't we arguing about deep grammar with "Me dueles" though ?
I know some folks here think of "Me duele" as figurative but The Rick Springfield example is the only example that fits such an expression, "Me duele" does not as far as I can see. We are discussing if it is grammatically possible to use those words to express anything useful at all. I'm sure we all agree the RS song is totally fine and understood.
I decided to download the Collins dictionary, Stucky101. I just got curious and downloaded their bigger one...not the concise version. Tomorrow I am going to go take a peek at a local bookstore, too.
In any case, here is what I get when I look up "doler" in my brand new dictionary here on my laptop:
Notice 2 (= afliger)
doler
VI
1 (Med) to hurt
¿(te) duele? does it hurt?
la inyección no duele the injection doesn't hurt
me duele el brazo my arm hurts
me duele la cabeza my head hurts (por migraña, resaca) I've got a headache
me duele el estómago I've got (a) stomach ache
me duelen las muelas I've got toothache
me duele la garganta I've got a sore throat
2 (= afligir) to hurt
ese comentario me dolió I was hurt by that comment, that comment hurt
no me duele gastarme el dinero en esto I don't mind spending money on this, spending money on this doesn't bother me
me duele no poder prestártelo I'm very sorry I can't lend it to you
¡ahí le duele! so that's where the problem is!
And as expected, the dictionary includes the pronominal form:
dolerse VPR (frm)
1 (= sufrir)
me duelo por su ausencia I miss him terribly
¡duélete de mí! pity me!
2 (= arrepentirse)
dolerse de algo to regret sth
se duele de su pasado egoísta she regrets her selfish past
dolerse de los pecados to repent of one's sins
3 (= quejarse) to complain
Webdunce
Good point. I saw that "Dinero" example too in my book.
No me duele el dinero - I'm not bothered/don't care about the money.
According to Heidita this should mean - "My money is in pain" right ?
Heidita you must have something to argue !
Since the dictionary entry for doler includes an example sentence of No me duele el dinero, I am no longer certain that I am wrong. Also, if we consider that one "hears all the time" phrases like Me duelen los zapatos, then I am back to thinking that doler means to cause grief or pain and, therefore, has the direct object (grief or pain) built into the verb.
- No me duele el dinero => The money does not cause me grief
- Me duelen los zapatos => The shoes are causing me pain => The shoes hurt me.
Please note that in the English sentence the shoes are causing me pain, me is an indirect object, while in the sentence the shoes hurt me, me is a direct object.
I wonder if the English word hurt is not being misunderstood. When I hurt you I can be causing you grief, pain, or physical injury. I get the impression that doler could never be used to mean "to cause physical injury." So, I think if I am causing you mental anguish or grief (or even pain, in some cases, like I am accidentally standing on your foot), you could easily say "me dueles" and me would properly be the indirect object.
No you didn't !! Haha. You just dissed the dictionary of this very site ? Haha Heidita is gonna be mad. I'm talking about a real book though from B&N. I'd expect it to be correct about such a massively important issue as whether or not a verb is transitive.
I don't get it. I'm supposed to use a dictionary's labeling system to find out how to use a verb but then I'm told not to trust what I see ? Then what is the use of those "vt,vi" labels in the first place ? None as far as I can see.
Here is an exercise. Suppose you have never seen or heard of the 2 words "hacer" and "doler". Now somebody gives you these 2 structures :
Me hace Me duele
If both are labeled as "vt,vi" then I cannot possibly know that there is a difference between them. One seems to mean "It makes me" and one "It hurts me". The ONLY clue I'd have would be if one was labeled as "vi" only !! Then I'd know that this one cannot take a DO. The only thing I can imagine doing is searching such words in as many dictionaries as possible and see what wins. I've seen this a few times now where people say "Oh don't trust the dictionary". Well jeez if I can't trust that what am I supposed to trust. Usually people say "Don't trust the internet, don't trust what other people say" Now on top of that its "Don't trust a dictionary" ?? I need some kind of reliable tool. I already got the Oxford Spanish dictionary but I"m not sure it is all that different. What are you guys using ? What are your books saying about doler ?
Maybe it's a regional thing and one dict deemed it worth adding whereas others do not ?
I'm lost.
I think to clear this up, it's easier to look at the "doler" sentences by tacking on the IOP at the end. Remember, if it was "It hurts HIM" then it wouldn't be "Le duele," rather the sentence would sound like "*LO duele" with a direct object pronoun, and that simply is not the case.
Me duele el estómago.
"The stomach hurts." + (TO ME) = My stomach hurts.
Te duelen los pies.
"The feet hurt." + (TO YOU) = Your feet hurt.
Le duele la cabeza.
"The head hurts". + (TO HIM/HER) = His/her head hurts.
It's not "The stomach is hurting me" but rather the individual event "The stomach hurts!" with "TO ME!!!" tacked on afterwards.
I'm not a native speaker, but I feel like wouldn't "Me dueles" give off a meaning of something like "You are in pain, and it ALSO hurts me."
Me dueles.
"You hurt." + (TO ME) = You hurt, and so I hurt too.
??
That's the other trouble I have. When I see such a sentence I can't always tell if it's the direct "me" or the indirect "me" since they are the same.
I agree. It is very confusing. I imagine it is more so for a German whose language prevents confusion in this area by using mir / mich. (Unfortunately, English also uses me / me). I used to study German...I hope to study it again in the future (I have forgot most of it).
I thought that if a verb was labled as "vi" only it means it cannot take a direct object hence "me dueles" is wrong. Then again what's the difference between "it" hurting me and "you" hurting me ? Both times "something/someone hurts me" I don't get it quite yet.
The English verb to hurt takes a direct object. The Spanish verb doler takes an indirect object. As I said before, it may be helpful to think of the direct object (pain, discomfort, or similar) as being part of the verb. I am not saying the direct object IS part of the verb, I am saying it may be helpful to think of it that way.
I think I would find it helpful to think of doler as meaning to give pain (to someone / something). When thought of this way, pain is the direct object and the someone or something will be the indirect object.
However, in the final translation, it needs to be converted to the verb to hurt and the indirect object converted to a direct object.
Me dueles => you give pain to me => you hurt me
Is me dueles ok to say or not ?
I don't see why "me dueles" would be wrong.
Me dueles => You are giving pain to me => You are hurting me
