subordinate clauses
If I'm writing a sentence with a subordinate clause such as 'instead of...' would I use the infinitive or the gerund?
ie
Ando en vez de viajando en coche.
o
Ando en vez de viajar en coche.
I know 'before arriving' would be 'Despues de llegar'.
Is is the same for all such examples?
Thank you!
Beks
7 Answers
Ando en vez de [del]viajando[/del] en coche.
o
Ando en vez de viajar en coche.
I know 'before arriving' would be 'Despues de llegar'.
Is is the same for all such examples?
The rule is simple, but is different from English: if you want to use a verb instead of a noun or pronoun, you MUST use infinitive:
*Quiero esto en vez de eso
Quiero comer en vez de salir (esto and eso are pronouns)
No me acordé de eso
No me acordé de comer
Me gusta eso
Me gusta comer
Iré después de eso / del partido / de...
Iré después de comer*
If it is not evident from the construction who is the subject of the subordinate verb, then you have to use a subordinate clause, generally with "que":
*Quiero eso en vez de que me des dinero
Quiero que vengas en vez de darme dinero
No me acordé de que venías
Me gusta que comas
Iré después de que comas*
The Spanish "gerundio", which is practically like a present participle in English (and not the English gerund), is mostly used to answer the question "How'", and for progressive constructions with "estar":
Vine corriendo (How did you come? Running)
Estoy comiendo (progressive)
It might help Beckabee to point out that the que in the second example is necessary because there are two people involved. That is, in the first example (Ando en vez de viajar en coche), "yo" is the only person involved in both clauses.
That's more useful that the typical rule given in many books that claim that infinitive is used when the subject of the principal and the subordinate clause are the same, but this is not always true:
Me gusta comer
Here, the subject of the main sentence is actually "comer", and the subject of this infinitive is "yo", which goes along with the indirect object "me" (and "a mí") of the main sentence, so there is only one person involved, but the subjects are different.
It might help Beckabee to point out that the que in the second example is necessary because there are two people involved. That is, in the first example (Ando en vez de viajar en coche), "yo" is the only person involved in both clauses. In the second example (Quiero eso en vez de que me des dinero), there are two people: "yo" in the first clause and "tú" in the second. That is why the que is needed. The infinitive is used when the subject is the same for both clauses, as Lazarus mentioned above.
(Yo) quiero eso en vez de que (tú) me des dinero. (different people)
(Yo) quiero eso en vez de darte dinero. (same person in both clauses)
Sorry, so would I have to put 'que' into my sentence?
ie Ando en vez de que viajar en coche. (That doesn't sound right'!)
No, it is not right. You are saying that you walk instead of "you" going by car. Since the subject of the second verb is also "I", you use infinitive... without "que":
Ando en vez de eso (using a pronoun)
Ando en vez de viajar en coche (using an infinitive)
And does that mean 'I want that instead of you giving me money.'?
Well... that "that" refers to something mentioned before, and which I have omitted, because it wasn't important for the explanation; it could be any item on display that you are pointing at, for example. The point is that infinitives have the same function that nouns and pronouns have (e.g. esto, eso, casa, uno, disco,...).
Sorry, so would I have to put 'que' into my sentence?
ie Ando en vez de que viajar en coche. (That doesn't sound right'!)
Because I don't understand why you've used 'que' here:
Quiero eso en vez de que me des dinero.
And does that mean 'I want that instead of you giving me money.'?
Thank you so much,
Beks
Thank you, that's really helpful! (Both replies... I never really understood the definition on gerund.)
If I'm writing a sentence with a subordinate clause such as 'instead of...' would I use the infinitive or the gerund?
ie
Ando en vez de viajando en coche.
o
Ando en vez de viajar en coche.
I know 'before arriving' would be 'Despues de llegar'.
Is is the same for all such examples?
Thank you!
Beks
Wait for someone that knows what they are talking about, but off the top of my head I would say that you have to use the infinitive because the object of a prepositional phrase is a noun and Spanish uses the infinitive to express the English gerund (ing form of verb used as a noun).
Would I use the infintive or the gerund'...
Be careful when using these terms in English/Spanish. In Spanish the (English)present participle is el gerundio. The infinitive is the (English) gerund.
So when speaking about Spanish grammar the question is..
Do I use the infinitive (English gerund) or the gerundio (English present participle).
When discussing English grammar it is..
Do I use the infinitive or the present participle (gerund) form of the verb?
It may seem just a matter of syntax, but there is a difference between the English and Spanish meaning of the word gerund as we've discussed in previous threads.
In simple terms the gerund is:
English - the ing form of the verb (present participle) only when used as a noun
Spanish - the ing form of the verb
