emigrado
I recently ran across this in a controversial political letter, where it was translated as "emigrant." In English emigrant means a person who has left a country. For example Gov. Schwartzeneger is an emigrant of Austria, and an immigrant of the US.
Can the word "emigrado" mean:
a. a person who has illegally immigrated to the US?
b. a person who has legally immigrated to the US, but is not a US citizen? and/or
c. a person who immigrated (legally or illegally) to the US and has since become a citizen?
I don't know the answer to this, and I'd like to.
18 Answers
A guy said:
The reason for my question is a letter which was recently sent to some people in California, in Spanish. It read, in part: "Se le avisa qui si su residencia en este pais es ilegal o si es emigrado, votar en una elecion federal es un delito." In another place, the letter urged the recipient to vote, if they were a U.S. citizen.
Reports are that people who were naturalized citizens felt that this was misleading and it called into question their right to vote. My question is whether, as a linguistic matter, their reading was a reasonable one.
PS: For any of you who are in doubt, if you are not a citizen of the U.S., you may not legally vote in a U.S. election.
This is misleading at best. My back-translation:
You are advise if your residence in this country is illegal or you are immigrant, voting in a federal election is a crime.
(Yes, I can speak better English than that. I'm mimicking the bad Spanish.)
The author of the letter, does not know how to write in Spanish.
A guy said:
The reason for my question is a letter which was recently sent to some people in California, in Spanish. It read, in part: "Se le avisa qui si su residencia en este pais es ilegal o si es emigrado, votar en una elecion federal es un delito." In another place, the letter urged the recipient to vote, if they were a U.S. citizen.Reports are that people who were naturalized citizens felt that this was misleading and it called into question their right to vote. My question is whether, as a linguistic matter, their reading was a reasonable one.PS: For any of you who are in doubt, if you are not a citizen of the U.S., you may not legally vote in a U.S. election.
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OK, your question makes sense now.
The answer seems to be two-fold. As Erika has told us, there are people who apparently use "emigrante" to mean a holder of a green card. However, that is not really correct usage, especially in such a formal and important context, and I would say that it is a mistranslation. It should have read "Se le avisa que si su residencia en este país es ilegal o si usted no es ciudadano estadounidense, votar en una elección federal es un delito."
It's a shame that a bad translation may affect people's decision whether or not to vote in such an important election. That translator should be shot!
The reason for my question is a letter which was recently sent to some people in California, in Spanish. It read, in part: "Se le avisa qui si su residencia en este pais es ilegal o si es emigrado, votar en una elecion federal es un delito." In another place, the letter urged the recipient to vote, if they were a U.S. citizen.
Reports are that people who were naturalized citizens felt that this was misleading and it called into question their right to vote. My question is whether, as a linguistic matter, their reading was a reasonable one.
PS: For any of you who are in doubt, if you are not a citizen of the U.S., you may not legally vote in a U.S. election.
James Santiago said:
Incidentally, the numbering of immigrant generations is different in Chinese and Japanese. An issei (first generation) in Japanese means the first generation to move to the new country, but in Chinese the "first generation" is the first one to be born in the foreign country.
Perhaps the Chinese and Japanese could be persuaded to introduce the term "ground floor generation" to reconcile their numbering schemes. (Since that's worked so well for English speakers.)
Natasha said:
Look here, for example. But certainly I defer to your expertise on all things Japanese-related.
The sentence "That the Japanese terms Issei, Nisei, and Sansei found their way into American vocabulary with American definitions is interesting..." in that article is misleading. The "American definitions" are exactly the same as in Japanese. The author seems to be saying that Americans aren't aware that those words are also used in other contexts in Japanese (eg, Carlos Tercero would be Karurosu Sansei), but that is irrelevant. The above three words are now part of the English lexicon, and to that extent, they are used in the same way in English as they are in Japanese.
To bring this back to Spanish, another loan word in English from Japanese is honcho, as in "He is the head honcho of the company." It looks like a Spanish word, but it is a corruption of ''/hanchou, which means the leader of a feudal Japanese clan.
Fair enough, Erika. There is nothing wrong with anecdotal evidence. I was just trying to confirm what you said.
As for "¿Eres emigrado o ciudadano'," I think that is just a case of using the words loosely, which all native speakers do from time to time. That is, it means "Are you an emigrant or a citizen," but a citizen could also be an emigrant, so it's not precise usage. It's probably just a short-hand way of talking.
Thanks for sharing what you've heard.
James Santiago said:
Why? Because I want to confirm its veracity. It is entirely possible that Erika is mistaken. It is equally possible (or maybe more so) that I am mistaken. So I'm asking for some evidence to confirm that Mexicans use the word emigrantes to mean someone living in the US with a green card.
As to the Japanese, I'm not aware that the words were used by Americans in a different meaning. Can you elaborate?
Incidentally, the numbering of immigrant generations is different in Chinese and Japanese. An issei (first generation) in Japanese means the first generation to move to the new country, but in Chinese the "first generation" is the first one to be born in the foreign country.
Look here, for example. But certainly I defer to your expertise on all things Japanese-related.
I'm not saying I'm 100% correct! all I'm saying is I know it is used more often about people with a green card, for instance, they ask you,; Eres Emigrado o Ciudadano''(some times when you go across the border) and I"M NOT SAYING ALL THE TIME!! ok, the answers vary between emigrado, ciudadano o inmigrante ilegal, people that have a green card are called emigrados, maybe there are not the only ones but that's how they are called here, I live by the border and all I'm saying is; That's the way I have heard mexicans here and on the mexican channel 12 news, like I said before I think that's how it goes, and that is what I have heard of ok, my friends.
Thank you this discussions are really interesting, Love being here.
James Santiago said:
Why? Because I want to confirm its veracity. It is entirely possible that Erika is mistaken. It is equally possible (or maybe more so) that I am mistaken. So I'm asking for some evidence to confirm that Mexicans use the word emigrantes to mean someone living in the US with a green card.As to the Japanese, I'm not aware that the words were used by Americans in a different meaning. Can you elaborate'Incidentally, the numbering of immigrant generations is different in Chinese and Japanese. An issei (first generation) in Japanese means the first generation to move to the new country, but in Chinese the "first generation" is the first one to be born in the foreign country.
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James Santiago said:
It is entirely possible that Erika is mistaken. It is equally possible (or maybe more so) that I am mistaken.
I've just checked with a Mexican friend of mine, and his version agrees with the one I wrote above.
Why? Because I want to confirm its veracity. It is entirely possible that Erika is mistaken. It is equally possible (or maybe more so) that I am mistaken. So I'm asking for some evidence to confirm that Mexicans use the word emigrantes to mean someone living in the US with a green card.
As to the Japanese, I'm not aware that the words were used by Americans in a different meaning. Can you elaborate?
Incidentally, the numbering of immigrant generations is different in Chinese and Japanese. An issei (first generation) in Japanese means the first generation to move to the new country, but in Chinese the "first generation" is the first one to be born in the foreign country.
James Santiago said:
Erika, I'm not saying you are wrong, but can you give us an instance (from the Net, etc.) of emigrantes meaning people who have a green card? Naturally, we can say that "José es emigrante de México, pero ahora tiene su green card," but that doesn't mean that the word emigrante per se means that he has his green card.
Why are you questioning it? This reminds me of the whole nissei sansei issei thing (hope I spelled that right) during WW II. U.S. officials took Japanese words and used them for something different.
James Santiago said:
...that doesn't mean that the word emigrante per se means that he has his green card.
Of course it does! We came up with that word several centuries ago knowing that one day we'd discover America, and eventually we'll need green cards to stay in USA.
Jokes apart, the distinction between inmigrante and emigrante is a matter of perspective:
inmigrante = arriving to a country trying to stay
emigrante = leaving a country to go to another to stay
A person is an "emigrante" from the perspective of his/her home country, and an "inmigrante" from the point of view of the country of arrival.
Erika,
I'm not saying you are wrong, but can you give us an instance (from the Net, etc.) of emigrantes meaning people who have a green card? Naturally, we can say that "José es emigrante de México, pero ahora tiene su green card," but that doesn't mean that the word emigrante per se means that he has his green card.
a person who has illegally immigrated to the US is called; Inmigrantes ilegales.
people that have a green card (who are not US Citizens yet and came legally to the US) are called; Emigrantes
and for who ever immigrated (legaly or illegally) to the US and become a citizen are called ; Migrantes
I think that is how it goes at least in Mexico, if you listen to the news your hear these 3 terms, hope it helps!!
