tal

Question

I always have problems with the word 'tal'. I know it can translate as 'such' but that doesn't always seem to fit. Does anybody have some more insights into this word.
Here are a couple of examples from my book (translation of Isaac Asimov) that I had problems with:

-No pasa nada malo con los Metalos, como tales Metalos. Como usted muy bien ha dicho son ciudadanos.- (Metalos =robots)

Lanning asintió. Había perdido la cuenta de la cantidad de veces que habría llegado a vender su alma con tal de despedir a Susan Calvin.

Answer 1

Thanks James, I find it hard to conceptualize even with your explanation, but flicking through a couple of books I see that is maybe because it is a concept rather than a word (like 'lo' can be)and one that varies depending on what other words it is combined with.

such, the aforementioned were mentioned, but an example given was: Te llamó una tal Jennifer. (somebody named Jennifer called you) where it is an unknown.

I see that the 'as long as' mentioned can be in the sense of 'provided that'
also 'con tal de? can be in order to:
Trabajaba mucho con tal de ganar dinero
but, Trabajaba mucho con tal de que su hija pudiera estudiar
(example of subjunctive with change of subject)
I'll definitely need to do a bit more digging on this one!

Answer 2

No pasa nada malo con los Metalos, como tales Metalos. Como usted muy bien ha dicho son ciudadanos.-

"Como tales" is used in a comparative sense,does means: así como, de igual modo, asimismo, cual o los cuales.

Lanning asintió. "Había perdido la cuenta de la cantidad de veces que habría llegado a vender su alma con tal de despedir a Susan Calvin"
"Con tal de que vayas tú, yo iré también" = As long as you go, I'll go, too

In this case the word "tal" is a conditional preposition. Also can be used as: con el objetivo de..., a condición de...

Answer 3

The second one would translate as: "He had lost count of how many times he would have sold his soul just to be rid of Susan Calvin."

As Priscy says, the idea of "con tal de" is "as long as," so here it is literally "as long as he could say goodbye to her." Con tal de is often followed by que + subjunctive.

Con tal de que vayas tú, yo iré también = As long as you go, I'll go, too.

Answer 4

I think I'm (starting) to get the hang of it.
I found a dicho whilst investigating.
De tal palo, tal astilla. From such a stick, such a splinter. [A chip off the old block.]

Answer 5

Thanks -it looks like I'll have to learn each phrase separately, are there any other short 'tal' phrases like this'

Answer 6

Hola!
En tus ejemplos:
"Como tal"---|- "as such"
"Con tal de"---|"as long as"

Que tengas un buen dia

Answer 7

I would say that in that case "como tales Metalos" means in their quality of Metalos, not considering them as a whole but only in this particular feature.