Nunca nos habíamos visto

Question

I saw a little bit of a telenovela recently, and a guy asked if two people had met before, and one of them responded no, nunca nos habíamos visto, which I would translate as "no, we had never seen each other before". What I would have expected the phrase to be is "no, nunca nos hemos visto" "No, we have never see each other before."

I saw other instances in that show of phrases like this in the past perfect where I would've expected the perfect.

Generally, it is taught that the past perfect and perfect of Spanish work pretty much the same way as in English. This seems to be an exception.

Do any native speakers have an insight into some rule or something that I am missing or have forgotten, or any rationale for this?

Gracias!

Seems to me if they are standing there looking at each other, they now have seen each other, and the answer would be that they never had seen each other (before now, but now they have seen each other.) - bosquederoble, Aug 4, 2017

Yes, that makes sense and is helpful. Thanks for commenting! - patt177, Aug 4, 2017

Answer 1

Well, this is contextual. If you say "nunca nos habíamos visto" it means that now you have seen him/her. So "I saw him a few hours ago, I had never seen him before" or even if you are with that person at that moment you will use "habíamos"

"Nunca nos hemos visto" means that still at the moment of speech you haven't seen him/her.

That makes sense?

Yes, I think this makes sense. I think the person who commented on my question above was basically saying the same thing - patt177, Aug 4, 2017

If I understand you correctly, it is habíamos because they have now seen each other. The other example was someone asking to pay rent early. The response was something like "nunca antes un inquilino me había ofrecido una cosa así - patt177, Aug 4, 2017

Yes! We may have posted at the same time, I did't see his answer when I posted this! I'm glad your question has been answered. - Shamelesspanish, Aug 4, 2017

which seems to be the same idea. No one "had" asked until that moment - patt177, Aug 4, 2017

You are right, the owner uses the past perfect to mention that it didn't happen before (but now it did). - Shamelesspanish, Aug 4, 2017

Anyway, thanks for your answer. - patt177, Aug 4, 2017

You know, it occurs to me that instances like these should really be made clearer in discussions or lessons on the perfect or past perfect. I don't think these instances are articulated well in most places, and these are pretty common phrases - patt177, Aug 4, 2017

Well, I'm sure that some teachers/schools may not explain this right (or maybe they don't take enough time because they think it is too obvious -one of the many mistakes Spanish schools do) but this is one of those rules that have very little grays! - Shamelesspanish, Aug 4, 2017

Not helped by the fact we don't always use it right in English. - bosquederoble, Aug 4, 2017