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Si + subjunctive... When is it appropriate ?

Si + subjunctive... When is it appropriate ?

5
votes

I had thought (and indeed been told on SD) that in Spanish when you form a clause beginning with 'si', your shouldn't use the subjunctive, and this has been borne out by most of what I've read or heard.

However, I've encountered the following phrase prefaced with 'si', which does take the subjunctive, and I wonder why it's different:

  • Me habría ido mejor si no hubiera hecho tanto calor = It would've been better for me if it hadn't been so hot...

Muchisimas gracias por ayudarme grin

12960 views
updated Jun 5, 2015
posted by Faldaesque

6 Answers

3
votes

It is only the present subjunctive that is not used after si, the past subjunctive is used all the time. See this link, in which I brought two relevant parts over. Please remember that when they talk about these unreal, contrary to fact, hypothetical situations that they do not necessarily have to be that hypothetical any more in Spanish than English, it’s just the spin you want to put on things, like the English:

If you were to give me that it would be nice. Were to give is past subjunctive- and clearly by framing it that way I do not think it impossible, instead I am just using it to more politely frame a request.

http://users.ipfw.edu/jehle/courses/condic.htm

I will tell you this guy has a number of very good posts on topics: http://users.ipfw.edu/jehle/S210.HTM

In contrast, an unreal or contrary-to-fact condition is one which will not come about or is viewed as being completely hypothetical. In this case, the “if” clause in normally in a past subjunctive tense, and the main verb is in a conditional tense.

Present or future time situations. The imperfect subjunctive is used in the “if” clause, and the conditional in the main clause:

Si yo fuera rico compraría un coche. If I were rich [I am not rich] I would buy a car. ¿Qué harías si fueras presidente? What would you do if you were president? [you aren't] Si Juana estuviera aquí, ¿le dirías la verdad? If Juana were here [she isn't here], would you tell her the truth?

Past time situations. Past perfect subjunctive in the “if” clause, conditional perfect in the main clause:

Si la hubiera visto, habría dicho algo. If I had seen her [I didn't see her] I would have said something. Si hubieras venido, te habrías divertido mucho. If you had come [you didn't come] you would have had a great time. ¿Habrías ido a la fiesta si yo la hubiera planeado? Would you have gone to the party if I had planned it? [I didn't plan it]

x

The present subjunctive is NOT used after si (“if”)!

Again, this last is for students, in Rac's link you can see where Lazarus says it is on rare occasion, but it is a good rule until you are so advanced you don't need rules.

updated Jun 4, 2015
edited by bosquederoble
posted by bosquederoble
:-) - Faldaesque, Jun 4, 2015
"It is a good rule until you are so advanced you don't need rules." Will that ever happen? ;-) - Winkfish, Jun 4, 2015
Probably not for me, but some people have skill and instinct for language, and don't have to beat it into their head like I do. :) - bosquederoble, Jun 4, 2015
I find the notion of 'past subjunctive' very misleading when it's actually used to refer to a future hypothetical eventuality... - Faldaesque, Jun 4, 2015
When I did other languages at school, teachers always spoke of the subjunctive forms as 'moods' without assigning them any temporal value... ;-) - Faldaesque, Jun 4, 2015
Yes it does seem to be an unfortunate choice of terms. :) - bosquederoble, Jun 4, 2015
Moods used to confuse me totally.. So I think, there are some rules, and a bit of feel for it. It has taken me a considerable amount of time and a lot of reading, but I feel much more confident with it now. The present subjunctive is the worst, unfortunat - annierats, Jun 4, 2015
unfortunatly everybody tells you to learn that first. When I started seeing it used in past/future I suddenly understood it better in the present. - annierats, Jun 4, 2015
Annie, I was also initially confused by the term 'moods' to refer to the subjunctive; I thought that moods were emotional states that people like teenagers got into on a bad day lol lol hahaha - FELIZ77, Jun 4, 2015
2
votes

Like in English:

If I were ....

updated Jun 5, 2015
posted by chileno
2
votes

Would this help?

Si with subjunctive

updated Jun 4, 2015
posted by rac1
Aye, gracias... It shall require some study... ;-) - Faldaesque, Jun 4, 2015
1
vote

Hello Falda ,

I believe that you need to use the imperfect subjunctive following the como si (as if ) construction, as illustrated in the example below:.

ex: Cuando le vi en la calle esta mañana, le saludé, pero me miró como si no me reconociera.

When I saw her in the street this morning I greeted her, but she looked at me as if she didn't recognise me!

The como si = as if /as though ,is referring to a hypothetical situation , as if something were true so takes the imperfect subjunctive.

The Oxford English /Spanish Dictionary confirms this, as it gives the entry under the Spanish word como: como si (+ subj) as if, as though

I hope this helps smile

Corrijan mi español si es necesario, por favor smile

updated Jun 5, 2015
edited by FELIZ77
posted by FELIZ77
Yeah, I've had women do that to me as well. ;-) - Winkfish, Jun 4, 2015
Just curious, did anyone bother to look at the links?? - rac1, Jun 4, 2015
I looked at all your links. I found "no sé si sea..." interesting and potentially learnable. :) - bosquederoble, Jun 4, 2015
Mediterrunio is someone I put credence in, before now I probably would have use sería, but I don know what options are available for sure. :) - bosquederoble, Jun 5, 2015
Thanks, Bosque. :) - rac1, Jun 5, 2015
1
vote

I hope this doesn't cause further confusion. I'm trying to learn too.

si and subjunctive

subjunctive after si

updated Jun 4, 2015
posted by rac1
1
vote

Your example is a hypothetical sentence= subjunctive.

Si no takes the subjunctive, even in the present, it is si, followed by a positive sentence that does not.

Sorry, this is not a very good explanation, I wonder where our Kiwi is, she was good at explaining grammar.

updated Jun 4, 2015
posted by annierats