Another personal "a" question.

Question

I know many questions have been asked already regarding the personal "a" (it is such an alien notion to English speakers) but I think this one is new. My understanding, from the lessons on sites such as Spanishdict and StudySpanish is that the personal "a" is only used for direct objects that are people, pets, or items that are being anthropomorphised (treated as human). But in a recent Duolingo discussion one user was adamant that all animate direct objects should be preceded by the accusative preposition "a" (he doesn't like the term personal "a"). Normally I would simply dismiss this as incorrect, but the user in this case is very knowledgable and normally provides accurate information.

For example:

I see the boy = Veo al nino

I see my [pet] cat = Veo a mi gato

I see the [stray] cat = Veo el gato (what I think is correct) Veo al gato (what he thinks is correct).

What are the thoughts of native Spanish speakers on this?

could you give me any example of this please? - cokee, Mar 11, 2015

Sure. I talk to my [pet] cat = Hablo con a mi gato. I talk to the [stray] cat = Hablo con el gato (what I've learnt) Hablo con al gato (what he is saying is right). - jellonz, Mar 11, 2015

Sorry Cokee - better examples edited into the question now. - jellonz, Mar 11, 2015

Now I think "Veo al gato" is the correct one, because "gato" is a direct object, "Lo veo", the same as the kid. usualmente no se hace distinción entre gato, persona, animal o cosa, independientemente del verbo que utilices. - cokee, Mar 11, 2015

jellonz you are correct,. We use "a" for indirect obejcts, of course, and for direct objects that are people, pets or items treated as human. This is the correct way according to Spanish grammar and also is the way we use. - SpanishSkypeorg, Mar 12, 2015

But "hablo con a mi gato" is not correct. Here, "gato" is not a direct object and also, you can´t use two prepositions together "con" and "a". Be careful with that. - SpanishSkypeorg, Mar 12, 2015

Gracias SpanishSkype. I realised the "hablo" example was really bad as soon as I'd written it :) Thanks for clarifying personal "a" usage from a native speaker's standpoint. - jellonz, Mar 12, 2015

Answer 1

I don't believe that the member you mentioned is correct.

You may find this info helpful from one of my favourite grammar books 'A New Reference Grammar of Modern Spanish'.

With animals, use of personal a depends on the extent to which the creature is humanized. Pets virtually always take personal a, but in other cases use of a depends on factors of emotion or context: the more familiar the language, the more likely the use of a. At the zoo one is likely to say vamos a ver a los monos 'let's go and see the monkeys' but, probably, vamos a ver los insectos 'let's go and see the insects. Monkeys being more lovable than cockroaches.

Gracias. That is what I have always thought too. It's just this particular user is normally correct (to the point of pedanticism) which is what made me wonder how native speakers use the personal "a". - jellonz, Mar 11, 2015

De nada :) - Kiwi-Girl, Mar 11, 2015

Answer 2

Well as a native speaker, you have 3 ways to say that sentence:

I talk to my pet:

Hablo con mi gato.

Hablo con el gato.

Le hablo al gato. (which probably wont answer).

You can also :

Hablar con la mesa.

Hablarle a tu hermano.

Que le hables a cualquier objeto inanimado, animado, persona, gato, lo que sea.

The only problem is that thing won't answer haha.

The construction will be the same.

(incorrect)"Hablo con al gato" (that's not direct object, I think thats indirect object, who receives the indirect action of the verb)

correct Hablo con el gato. O Le hablo al gato.

Espero haberte ayudado!

I edited for capitalization. - rac1, Mar 11, 2015

Sorry. That was a terrible example I used with the "talk to" only confusing things. I'll edit a better example into my question. - jellonz, Mar 11, 2015

:( - cokee, Mar 11, 2015

Answer 3

I have always heard that when the personal a precedes a direct object it is only when there are people or known pets or other anthropomorphized objects. And with any of these it isn't used if the people are mentioned "just in general." I need three carpenters, for example...would not use the personal a because the carpenters are not known to the speaker. Whereas, I met three of the carpenters would use the personal a.

Also, I don't think that the personal a is only used with direct objects. When indirect objects are clarified or stressed with a preposition they can use the person a. For example:

He likes the university. Le gusta la universidad. The university is pleasing to him. The university gives him pleasure.

If you don't know who le refers to it might mean he, him, she, her or it.

To clarify you can add a él.

A él le gusta la universidad.

That too, is a personal a and it is in front of an indirect object.

The indirect object in the phrase a él is not a le for two reasons: 1. It wouldn't help to clarify where it is he, she or it. 2. The pronouns used as objects of prepositions (which is what the personal a is) are mí, tí, él, ella, usted, nostotros, ellos, ellas or ustedes even though it is refering to an indirect object whose pronouns would be me, te, le, nos and les.

Answer 4

Please forget that about the human vs nonhuman/inanimate thingy....

I see my cat = veo mi gato (I recognize it.)

I see the cat = veo el gato (I am looking at a particular cat)

I see the cat sitting/running etc = veo al (contraction of "a el") gato sentado/corriendo

The last example maybe has to do with a verb being or not transitive/intransitive?, this comment is geared towards those that like to go blind with grammar.

]:-D

Are you saying a native speaker would not use the personal "a" unless it was necessary for a certain verb? Is something like "veo a mi hijo" not correct? - jellonz, Mar 12, 2015

"veo a mi hijo" is correct. Why do you understand that i said a native would not use "a" in phrase where it is needed? - chileno, Mar 12, 2015

It was my understanding that a pet should be treated like a human, so "veo a mi hijo" and "veo a mi gato" but in your example you say "veo mi gato" is correct? - jellonz, Mar 12, 2015

Answer 5

Now that you've changed your example to 'el gato' I would say that we have now wandered into the realms of specificity (I hope that's a word lol) which some grammarians say is another reason why the a is used.

Now that it's 'the' cat you obviously have a specific cat in mind, or rather you are looking at a specific cat and referirng to it and no other.

Veo al gato.

If you just said 'un' gato and put it into a sentence that allows for any random cat then you could perhaps use ver with 'un gato' omitting g the a.

Si ves un gato, atrápalo.

If you see a cat (any old cat), catch it.

But veo a tu gato.

I see your cat.

Again it's specific, not because of any personal attachment I might have to it but just because you have a cat and this specific one is it.

So to go back to the assertion of the member you mentioned in the beginning, even with this example the a is needed not because it's an animated object (because it's also a cat in the example without the a) but it's needed because it's specific (or in other examples because you have a personal attachment to it).