Why "se" here?

Question

Hi all,

Here's the sad headline posted by BBC Mundo: "Avión de Malaysia Airlines se estrella en Ucrania."

I'm wondering, why is "se" used here? It is because estrella also translates to "star"? I guess I'm just missing something...I don't see this sentence as a passive construction (it has a subject).

Thoughts? Thanks-- José

Please fill out your profile so that we may better help you. Bienvenido y buena suerte amiga. - ray76, Jul 21, 2014

Answer 1

If the "se" was taken away, how then would that change the general translation?

Estrellar is a transitive verb, so it must act upon something. Without se in this sentence we would have to ask: ¿Estrelló qué cosa? Without se in this case the sentence would not make sense because there is no direct object.

"Se me cayeron los platos." Does "me cayeron los platos" not translate the same?

The se in this sentence indicates a sudden unexpected action. To say it without se would be gramatically correct, but it would sound strange because this type of action is usually a sudden one.

;) Thanks for the clear explanation - gringojrf, Jul 17, 2014

:) - FELIZ77, Jul 18, 2014

Answer 2

gringo et al:

The "se" is there because the cause of the crash is unknown so the blame is being placed on the plane itself. More or less.

Please stop that nonsense "whose blame" stuff

Se cayeron los platos = the plates fell

Se me cayeron los platos = I dropped the plates (the plates fell from me)

Se te cayeron los platos = You dropped the plates (the plates fell from you)

Me cayeron los platos... = The plates fell on me

Te cayeron los platos... = The plates fell on you

Please talk to me.

lol

Answer 3

Perhaps another example that confuses me. "Se me cayeron los platos." Does "me cayeron los platos" not translate the same? - JoeChatt

This is a perfect example. Se me cayeron los platos. The plates fell. I was there but I was not responsible, they fell all by them selves. Of course, in reality this is not true.

Me cayeron los platos. the plates fell from me. or I dropped the plates. You take full responsibility.

I say this somewhat jokingly. Spanish is a no-fault language. So the se me cayeron formula is almost always used.

Answer 4

The "se" is there because the cause of the crash is unknown so the blame is being placed on the plane itself. More or less.

Yes, not quite blaming the plane, but really just taking away the need to assign a cause. - bosquederoble, Jul 17, 2014

Thanks bosque. Better stated. - gringojrf, Jul 17, 2014

Answer 5

Ok, that makes more sense. Thanks. If the "se" was taken away, how then would that change the general translation?

Perhaps another example that confuses me. "Se me cayeron los platos." Does "me cayeron los platos" not translate the same? - JoeChatt, Jul 17, 2014

Answer 6

Sometimes it's not so much that the se should be translated or that it has a special meaning in itself, it's just that it's an integral part of the pronominal form of the verb. And in many cases the pronominal verb form has a completely different meaning to the regular verb form.

Estrellar to fling or throw something into something else, estrellarse, to be badly affected due to being involved in or a crash

So the plane wasn't flinging something else anywhere. It itself was involved in a crash so there's no other option than to use the pronominal verb form, complete with se.

estrellar1. 1. tr. Sembrar o llenar de estrellas. U. m. c. prnl.

1. tr. coloq. Arrojar con violencia algo contra otra cosa, haciéndolo pedazos. U. t. c. prnl.

2. tr. Freír un huevo.

Estrellarse

1. prnl. Quedar malparado o matarse por efecto de un choque violento contra una superficie dura.

2. prnl. Fracasar en una pretensión por tropezar contra un obstáculo insuperable.

3. prnl. Dicho de una persona: Chocar con las ideas u opiniones de otra, contradiciéndolas abiertamente