Estuvieron/ Fueron - help me understand the usage here.

Question

Here is my sentence from Palabra del día:

Estos garabatos fueron /estuvieron dibujados durante una reunión en la que un participante estaba aburrido.

I went back and forth on fueron and estuvieron before choosing the wrong one, estuvieron. No matter how much I learn and relearn, I still get confused with ser and estar.

I'm asking for a simple explanation for the use of 'fueron' in this sentence. I went over the grammar section and did the exercises and still make mistakes like this. Is it because it was drawn and doesn't change?

I think it's because the drawings were done, over and done with , during the boring meeting. Finished, given point in time. - annierats, Dec 2, 2012

Answer 1

It seems like you've got it but just to add a little info re the passive voice for future reference (hopefully I've got this right lol)

ser + past participle = passive voice

In the true passive voice the doer is also stated after the word 'por'.

Estos garabatos fueron dibujados por mi sobrino.

These doodles were drawn by my nephew.

As you can see this passive voice construction describes an action.

If the doer isn't stated then the reflexive form is more commonly used.

Se dibujaron a mano los garabatos.

The doodles were drawn by hand. (still talking about the action, just not saying who drew them)

But if you're referring to a result or the state of something, rather than the action, then you would use estar.

Los libros estuvieron escritos en inglés.

The books were written in English. (referring to their written state not the action of them being written)

Excellent! - francobollo, Dec 2, 2012

Thanks Kiwi. I feel this is one of those things that my brain is going to have to process before it seems easy.... maybe next year it will be better. Thanks. That helps me a little more to get it. - katydew, Dec 2, 2012

thanks guys :) - Kiwi-Girl, Dec 3, 2012

Answer 2

From suite101.net (I hope this helps!)

Voz pasiva perifrástica con estar + participio

Se llama también pasiva de resultado, ya que informa del resultado final sin interesarnos por el proceso. El complemento directo también pasa a ser sujeto de la oración pasiva y el complemento agente no es necesario y generalmente no aparece.

Esta casa está bien cuidada.

El libro está terminado.

Las calles están destruidas.

---

Voz pasiva perifrástica con ser + participio

El complemento directo de la oración pasa a ser sujeto paciente de la oración pasiva. El verbo en pasiva se construye con el verbo ser y el participio del verbo que concuerda con el sujeto paciente en género y número. El sujeto de la oración activa pasa a ser complemento agente, precedido por la preposición por.

Juan José Campanella dirigió la película. La película fue dirigida por Juan José Campanella.

La abuela cuidaba a los nietos. Los nietos eran cuidados por la abuela.

El alcalde inauguró la nueva estación. La nueva estación fue inaugurada por el alcalde.

Buenissimo - gsdfsggs, Dec 2, 2012

... and it is ser, because the direct object being described refers directly back to the subject? - rogspax, Dec 2, 2012

Great explanation. Though as a relative new person, I had to read it about 4 times to absorb it. So, it seems, it is not estar, because it is not ´sin interesamos por el proceso´... ... - rogspax, Dec 2, 2012

Thanks Franco. - katydew, Dec 2, 2012

Answer 3

fueron is a verb conjunted by ser! darling it takes a lot of practice before fully understanding the differences between ser and estar.....we use ser when we are talking about description, occupation, characteristics, time, origin and relationship... we use estar when talking about position, location, action, condition and emotion!!! hope i helped!

Thanks, Trisha, and welcome to the forum! Please don't forget to use proper punctuation and capitalization in your posts. Thanks! - --Mariana--, Dec 2, 2012

Trisha, thanks for taking time to answer the question. Is it possible to add your profile information to know your Spanish level. That is always helpful so we know which language is your first language. Thanks! - katydew, Dec 2, 2012

Your Welcome :) am glad i helped - trishafrancis, Dec 22, 2012

Answer 4

I'm not sure if I understand this, but here is how I understand Franco's explanation:

In the case of estar/ser + participio

Estar - use this if the sentence doesn't concern itself about any kind of process that went on.

Ser - use this if the process is the subject of the sentence and also lets you know by whom it was done using 'por'.

So even though 'por' is not used, it is understood, and the process of drawing the doodles was the subject of the sentence?

Still a little confused but the article from suite 101.net helps.

Is there someone who could give me 2 comparision sentences in English with the Spanish under it that would be similar to my sentence? Maybe that will help me understand the difference.