New York Spanish
Is the Spanish spoken in New York by Dominicans born in America proper or is it mostly slang?
6 Answers
I agree with all of the answers.
I think it manly depends on the education level of the person. Most Puerto Ricans and Dominicans that I encountered on the streets (back when I lived in the Bronx in the 90's) spoke horrific Spanish and I wanted nothing to do with the language.
Later, after meeting people in the University, I learned that Spanish is actually a very beautiful language and I became interested in studying to become fluent.
Today I speak with both highly educated Guatemalans and those who learned it as a second language (the indigenous Mayans) ....both groups have taught me a lot!
There are lots of Americans that butcher the English language.
You've got that right!
Ok, here's the thing - Spanish heritage speakers have varying degrees of fluency and correctness in their speech, just like native born Americans do. There are lots of Americans that butcher the English language. Most people use slang. But, there are also learned Americans who value education and strive to communicate properly. The basic answer is . . . it depends!
While I live in NYC, my Spanish is not good enough to be able to participate in this conversation, a conversation which is very interesting to me for reasons I won't get into.
Still, I would offer the following idea: to me, language is 'bad' if it fails its essential function, namely to be able to communicate. Particularly, if it works with the population of people you want it to work with. I am very curious to hear more about what Mariana means by 'horrific' Spanish, because that could mean a lot of things.
I am mindful of the original post, which asked about slang and whether the Spanish was grammatically proper. ScottyB is not asking, as I take it, whether the Spanish is 'good' or 'broken'. Rather, whether is it proper by book/conventional standards.
It may not be conventional Spanish, and it may impeed communication to wider populations, but for me, unconventional Spanish does not in any way mean bad Spanish. Different? Yes. But that does not entail a value judgement of better/worse. Rather, it just means that it not does conform to our expectations of what Spanish 'should' be.
Now is it sexist? Ugly? Grammatically messy? If so, I'd love to hear it.
But that is a far cry from saying 'bad' Spanish, I would offer.
From what I know, most US-born whatever Spanish-speaking nationality speak broken to very bad Spanish, even people who migrated when they were around 10 speak something that doesn't sound quite right. I could spot them from miles away. There are a few exceptions, though.
I am very curious to hear more about what Mariana means by 'horrific' Spanish, because that could mean a lot of things.
What I meant was grammatically "bad" (a value judgment--see below) Similarly, I consider a lot of the English spoken by my son and his friends "horrific." For example,
I ain't got none
He don't understand
I seen him yesterday
.....unconventional Spanish does not in any way mean bad Spanish.
I hear what you're saying and thank you. I agree that I am being judgmental by saying that certain groups of people (those uneducated teenagers are the worst) mercilessly butcher the English and Spanish languages. A biased, judgmental view is not good for many reasons and I'll think more on why I have this prejudice and how to work on it.
My current (biased) thinking is that Spanish by the book is the "correct" and "pure" Spanish and that people should try to speak with correct grammar, write with correct spelling, etc., to respect and preserve a language. This indeed may be a "class prejudice" because I am favoring those who are educated and speak "proper" Spanish and English. I notice that when a person's speech does ".... not conform to our expectations of what Spanish 'should' be," as you say, my prejudice meter goes off the chart! Need to work on that, obviously, because there's no much worse than a Know-It-All!
However, you are quite right when you get to the bottom line and say that it's all about communication and whether you're getting your point across to your audience.
I live in New York. I told myself that I didn't want to learn "Spanglish". The fact is, it's pretty unavoidable. Everywhere you go there will be a certain way the locals speak. It's going to vary and American Spanish is no exception.This isn't to say people are ignorant, it's just the way it is. When you think about it, it makes sense that people have their own way of saying things. It would be pretty confusing to have people from other countries saying their words in a place where it isn't said.
