The use of a Moderator's personal message.

Question

Hola Spanishdict.com members,

The use of a Moderator's personal message inside the forum is a violation of rule #1 and against the Moderator Overview. When a Moderator sends a warning to a member this is not to be published within the forum. The member who has received the warning is to work with that Moderator through personal messages. The member who has been upset or warned by a Moderator is not to copy and paste, in part or in full, the Moderator’s personal message.

Please see the Moderator Overview. In part it says:

Clarification of Moderator Action If you need clarification on why your post was removed or why you were warned, reach out to the Moderator directly through a Private Message, which you can send from the profile page of the Moderator.

You may feel free to answer this topic. Any answers or comments that are off topic or disruptive to the learning of the community will be deleted.

Bandita

Moderator

Bandit, I agree that I broke the rule about posting a PM. Actually I didn´t know about it. I have always been more concerned with helping folks with their study of Spanish, so I obviously neglected to take the time to learn the rules. - 005faa61, Jun 8, 2012

But what you and the other mods don´t seem to realize is that by making such a fuss over these minor issues, you are providing great entertainment for the masses here. It´s just one broken rule - nothing as bad as the situation in Sryia - 005faa61, Jun 8, 2012

I agree to this point, that's why I replied through a private message. Thanks:) - ZAYESHA, Jun 8, 2012

Answer 1

Why the secrecy? Are moderators saying things that they are ashamed of in these messages? Are they afraid that the majority of the users will not agree with their position?

The moderators have the power to chastise and ban members, what defense do the users have to a moderator who is overstepping, other than to post the message for all to see and make their own judgements. Nothing good is ever done in secret.

Please don't send my a personal message as a result of this posting. If you have something to say to me say it in front of everyone.

Abrazos. - annierats, Jun 7, 2012

Free speech. What an interesting idea! Maybe we should try it one day - 005faa61, Jun 7, 2012

There is no secrecy Gringo, the point of us sending private messages is that we do not want to make it a public-non learning issue. You are more than welcome to speak to the moderators or myself about issues that you do not agree with us. - martha-sd, Jun 7, 2012

But, putting them in the forum diminishes the learning. And, Julian, it has nothing to do with freedom of speech, it is about the learning that is missed when politics comes into play. - martha-sd, Jun 7, 2012

Politics comes into play with every human interaction. As for diminishing the learning, I personally think a comment attached to a response (just like those above) serves a better learning purpose than a private message does. - gringojrf, Jun 8, 2012

Martha, I disagree. In fact, it´s just the opposite. When you censor ("you" in general), you stifle the learning process. Life is full of conflict and so is language. I believe most learners of Spanish are here to learn the language as it is really spoken - 005faa61, Jun 8, 2012

and not some fantacy language full of controlled utterances. This is not, at least it didn´t used to be, kindergarten. As long as conflict can be had in a respectful manner, I see no problem with it. Grown-ups call it "debating" - 005faa61, Jun 8, 2012

We can debate all you want, Julian, but the comments made lately on the forum are not much debate but accusations. If you are accusing someone you have already formed your opinion and are not up for debating anything. - martha-sd, Jun 9, 2012

Need I remind you that all moderators on our site are volunteering their time to help maintain a positive learning environment. I would like to see other volunteer to do this and see how much strife they get from people who want to debate their actions. - martha-sd, Jun 9, 2012

Answer 2

Just counting the votes given to the various responses it seems that the community does not agree with this posting. This is just something that I think the moderators should take into consideration.

I agree gringojrf - motosierra, Jun 8, 2012

such an attitude! - Spenco, Jun 8, 2012

Answer 3

As someone who received a warning message today, I can tell you that I hope that someone is moderating the moderators. I only hope that they would be sure of their facts before sending these letters. I consider a letter of warning very serious and something that should be used as a last resort. This should be a place of learning, not a place where we fear to post because we may get a warning or even banned. I am sorry to see it come to this.

well said sanlee - motosierra, Jun 8, 2012

Very true =) - diagonx, Jun 8, 2012

=) - gringojrf, Jun 8, 2012

Join the club, Sandy. I received mine today as well with a "concern about my attitude." One positive note however: it´s nice to feel like I´m back in high school again, ja ja! - 005faa61, Jun 8, 2012

I know from experience that moderators are not always sure of their facts and can be pretty rude too in their approach and very quick to use their powers in a way for which there is no justification at all.I hope that this is not starting all over again - Castor77, Jun 8, 2012

Though I shouldn't use the plural. I'm referring to one particular moderator who decided to leave herself. - Castor77, Jun 8, 2012

I cannot even imagine what justification there would be to give you a warning. I've never seen you do anything out of line. - Spenco, Jun 8, 2012

Answer 4

Well, moderators should also be clear about their role, I don't like to have my posts deleted wihtout a valid reason, like being supposedly off-topic when I'm giving a direct answer to a question; it's not like we're here to say what a moderator wants us to say and only that, if I'm not disrespecting anyone or actuallybeing off-topic, then the posts should also be respected. I also agree with other participants, if this is an open community why should we keep things a secret from other members, especially if you are being affected by those measures.

well said - Spenco, Jun 8, 2012

Answer 5

Although nothing to do with the theme of this post, how on earth did the phrase 'reach out to' make its way into the official regulations of a language website?

A private message from a moderator, representing what should be the official view of those managing this community of which we are all a part, is very different in its nature to a personal message from someone not associated with the above. Although I have no interest in what has been said by whom to whom, it is essential that moderators' decisions be available for scrutiny if deemed necessary if we want this community to be seen to be justly managed.

I'm sure that we would all hope that decisions made by moderators are just, reasonable and without prejudice. If this were always the case then why would anyone wish to publicise a judgement made, unless they were maybe a mentalist?

Answer 6

@Mariana. I quite agree that's how it should be, but it's not how it always was. I don't know what exactly provoked the current controversy, and therefore I can't and won't comment on it. But I had some very unpleasant experiences with a former moderator. Being a volunteer doesn't give anyone the right to lord it over a bunch of serfs she can whip into shape or send off to the dungeons to her hearts desire. As someone rightly remarked, decisions made by moderators should be just, reasonable and without prejudice. And based on the official rules which are known to all of us and not on whimsical personal additions and wild accusations and speculations.

I sincerely hope that this will definitely be something of the past. But the very fact that Bandit makes it possible to discuss this on the forum seems to indicate that things have changed for the better.

I can assure you that we are doing everything we can to make sure none of the past mistakes are repeated. The current Moderators do not feel as if they are above the rules and can arbitrarily pick on members. - --Mariana--, Jun 8, 2012

Castor, I agree with you and know of your experience. But the first PM a moderator sends you now is not demeaning or condescending. - martha-sd, Jun 9, 2012

Answer 7

The rules are the rules. They are in place to keep this site manageable. There are hundreds of people here, and if all expressed their interpertations of the rules it would be chaos.

Since nobody has to stay here if they do not want to, and if to them the rules are too restrictive, there is one option I can think of...

My opinion is that the rules are fair, and that I fully support Bandit and the other moderators.

Answer 8

It's too bad and very sad that our moderators have to continue to remind us to behave like adults. It is very clear to me that a personal message is a private message (between the sender and the receiver) and should not be made public.

I don't know the reasons behind the personal message nor do I care to know (because it is private and none of my business). Regardless of the circumstances, we need to respect the rules.

Please don't let your feelings get hurt over a personal message you receive. Try to respond in a positive way with the sender (only).

We are all from different cultures and age groups, but we are trying to come together as one unique family learning daily from each other. We are not only learning a new language, we are learning to respect our differences. Please, let's not forget why we are here!

I agree, Nilda, our moderators volunteer their time to make this site function in a positive and friendly manner. - martha-sd, Jun 7, 2012

No offense intended. But real life for adults is full of conflict and differing opinions. That is why we have free speech in the USA. - gringojrf, Jun 8, 2012

Answer 9

Gringo said:

Are moderators saying things that they are ashamed of in these messages? Are they afraid that the majority of the users will not agree with their position?

We are protecting the privacy of the member when we send a PM (private message) and trying not to air our dirty laundry in public. I'd be horrified if someone posted my PMs on the forum, just like if someone went through my personal email account. I have nothing to be ashamed of--I just consider some things private.

Nilda said:

It's too bad and very sad that our moderators have to continue to remind us to behave like adults.

Exactly...you have no idea how much time Moderators spend doing this!

Answer 10

Castor 77 said:

I know from experience that moderators are not always sure of their facts and can be pretty rude too in their approach and very quick to use their powers in a way for which there is no justification at all.I hope that this is not starting all over again - Castor77

Could you please send me a PM regarding this?

We certainly do N O T want any problems like we had with the past moderator(s) to continue.

Sorry, but I already reacted before I'd seen this message. I'll send you a PM later today. - Castor77, Jun 8, 2012

Mariana.... I have no recollection of there being problems with past moderators....geez where was I? - Spenco, Jun 8, 2012