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What does fluency in a language mean to you?

What does fluency in a language mean to you?

5
votes

On another post, I found it interesting that being fluent in a language means a lot of different things to different people. I believe that it is really difficult to be fluent in any language. I think that to be fluent, you have to know how to say not only what you want or need to say, but pretty much anything that can be said. I also believe that most people never reach true fluency with a language becuase their grammer and sentax etc are not always correct. Apparently, many people feel that to be fluent means other things. I am interested in seeing what everyone thinks.

Thanks

13608 views
updated Feb 1, 2012
edited by farallon7
posted by kdrinning
I have had the same vision as you have, believing that to be fluent, you should know the language in and out. But according to these posts, I believe we both should readjust our view. - inridk, Feb 1, 2012
...the same thoughts as you have* - inridk, Feb 1, 2012

15 Answers

11
votes

Fluency in any language is when you reach the point where you can understand what it is been said at the speed of speech. When you do not have to translate in order to understand. It has nothing to do with no having an accent or not knowing all the words of a given language. If for any reason you do not know a word, you just ask what is that, and they would tell you in that same language without having to go to your first language and translate in order to understand or learn. I am a native Spanish speaker, but there are words that I do not know because they are related to a field that I am not familiar with. In order for me to learn that word, I do not need to find its equivalent in English, Greek, French etc. I'd just ask, what's that?

**- Note: Fluency does not mean that you know every single word, it's applications, rules, exceptions to the rules, inflections, idioms, derivations, accents etc.

updated Feb 1, 2012
edited by farallon7
posted by farallon7
..any given language. - 00e657d4, Jan 31, 2012
Thanks! - farallon7, Jan 31, 2012
If that were* the case....be really/truly* fluent...Good answer! - Goldie_Miel, Feb 1, 2012
Thanks! - farallon7, Feb 1, 2012
6
votes

I also believe that most people never reach true fluency with a language becuase their grammer and sentax etc are not always correct.

Not meaning at all to put you on the spot, I should be curious to know whether you consider yourself a fluent English speaker, seeing as I detect at least three spelling errors in the statement quoted above.

I think that most people (possibly including yourself) would agree that you are a fluent and native speaker of English, regardless of whether your grammar, syntax, spelling and so forth are perfect or not.

I understand fluency as the capacity to express oneself in a given language without having to pause to think about what is being said, or about what is the correct construction of a sentence, while at the same time one's audience accepts the message naturally, without constant thoughts along the lines of "ah, this person is still learning the language".

updated Feb 1, 2012
edited by Gekkosan
posted by Gekkosan
Pars mí ... for me fluency is not about grammar or syntax. Fluency is not the same thing as educated or master. - Pablo-Peligroso, Jan 31, 2012
It is true that there are spelling errors in my post, but they are not because I don't know how to spell. They are careless typing errors. - kdrinning, Jan 31, 2012
Sorry, ran out of space above. Anyway, I believe that as a native English speaker I am somewhat fluent, but I guess what I am trying to say is that fluency is something we can always reach harder to achieve. - kdrinning, Jan 31, 2012
I concur with other opinions in that perhaps you are mixing the concepts of "fluency" with "perfection". I believe they are different concepts. I think you are a fluent speaker, and I unmodestly consider myself a fluent speaker as well. - Gekkosan, Jan 31, 2012
Perfect - no, far from it. Fluent, yes. - Gekkosan, Jan 31, 2012
I enoy your 'immodest' posts Gekkosan, I would be content to be half as fluent in Spanish as you are eloquent in English! - Marmaid, Jan 31, 2012
5
votes

I also believe that most people never reach true fluency with a language because their grammar and syntax etc are not always correct.

I don't think we should confuse fluency with perfection... mistakes happen and that is part and parcel of being a human being.

I believe that fluency in a language is the ability to understand and express oneself readily and effortlessly. No more, no less.

A pretty difficult prize to reach, even without worrying over knowing every rule of grammar.

My two cents. smile

updated Feb 1, 2012
edited by hollyjollyberry
posted by hollyjollyberry
I agree. Uneducated people are fluent. - Pablo-Peligroso, Jan 31, 2012
Education level has nothing to do with fluency. I believe that fluency is a matter of how well you use the language, not how educated you can sound. People both educated & uneducated can be less than fluent in their language if they don't use it properly. - kdrinning, Jan 31, 2012
Indeed. - Jadey7, Jan 31, 2012
3
votes

I like the definition that you can converse without effort and translation. I do not believe in gramatical correctness or size of vocabulary as these are things derived from education, not from being fluent in conversation.

There is a mastery level of a language though, and I know how tough it is to reach a satisfactory level of mastery even in my own native tongue. It's REALLY hard. I made it through the masters level of school, and have always continued to build my vocabulary, but I'm still far from a master of the English language. For one thing is you are not conversant in the great works of literature then you cannot possibly be a master of the language. That is reserved for very educated people.

And don't you think that snobbery goes along with a status like that in many cases? I've seen language masters wield their knowledge like a weapon, or a way to establish superiority in a social group or work group. That ain't right. That's just BS to put it bluntly. Mastery over a language should not separate us from other people but it does in many cases. Fluency draws us closer together and master often seems to fragment us.

updated Feb 1, 2012
posted by Pablo-Peligroso
I like the way that you think! Being "fluent" in a language is not reason for snobbery. - kdrinning, Jan 31, 2012
Good points. Language should draw us together. - pesta, Jan 31, 2012
Great points Pablo:) There should be no snobbery. These people are no better (or worse) than any of us here. The literature they praise so highly maybe well wriitten and therefore a great example of that language but is the subject matter really of - FELIZ77, Jan 31, 2012
much interest to the ordinary man in the street? - FELIZ77, Jan 31, 2012
I enjoyed reading Animal farm , the James Herriot stories and The Saint by Leslie Charteris much more than Classical Literature. Nevertheless, I still developed a broad vocabulary - FELIZ77, Jan 31, 2012
love your post. - JazSpanish, Feb 1, 2012
3
votes

I agree with so much that has been already been said by both Fallaron and Gekko in their posts in response to the question and which they have expressed so well!. I am fluent in English and can obviously express anything I want to say to people in a clear, intelligible manner; although on certain occasions when faced with some kinds of intimidating people I may freeze up a little or stumble on some words.

Fluency does mean you can express yourself in a fluid kind of way (ie like a flowing river ) without stopping to think how to say what you want to say or how other natives would say it. However, It does not mean that you know everything there is to know about your language: grammar, slang, idioms and the specialist/technical vocabulary used by a myriad of different trades and professions. Sometimes I forget words like ''mortgage'' or ''overdraft'' but can normally express myself by describing what they are.An intelligent fluent speaker will develop ''work arounds'' ie: other ways of saying the same thing to get their point across as clearly and succintly as possible.

When I think of people who can communicate effectively with a range of different people I often think of lawyers, teachers and doctors. These people are specialists in their own fields/spheres of work and know the jargon associated with each of their professions but lawyers are not familiar with, and usually do not understand the specialist terms employed by the medical profession nor vica-versa.

Technical vocabulary excluded, it should be possible for a native with an extensive vocabulary and good communication skills to be able to say almost anything they want to say. Other emotional factors like fear of rejection or lack of confidence may hinder them from expressing it, but they apart from these factors they should be able to communicate freely.

Finally, even as a native speaker of English I am still reading (books, magazines, internet articles, etc...) and coming across new words that I didn't even know existed lol hahaha so It can be quite a humbling experience to realize that you (one) will always be learning while living on this earth and never coming to the point when you will know or understand everything! I will leave that job to God! raspberry wink grin

updated Feb 1, 2012
edited by FELIZ77
posted by FELIZ77
Good response , Feliz - heliotropeman, Jan 31, 2012
Thank you very much, helio :) - FELIZ77, Jan 31, 2012
Well said, Feliz :) - Goldie_Miel, Feb 1, 2012
Thank you very much, Goldie :) - FELIZ77, Feb 1, 2012
2
votes

mumbo jumbo

Fluent is to be able to speak in another language to a person who is a native speaker in that language - without them answering in English!!

updated Feb 1, 2012
edited by CaliforniaDreamer
posted by CaliforniaDreamer
Hahaha! Love the picture, CBruegge! - ajaks, Feb 1, 2012
Yes! - Gekkosan, Feb 1, 2012
2
votes

Hola everyone. Fluency in my point of view is to communicate with others clearly without any obstacles as if you speak to your brother , it's not all about Grammer but also about mutual understanding.

updated Feb 1, 2012
posted by shish75
2
votes

I've written six books and dozens of articles in English, and I can tell you this: without the benefit of an editor and proof-reader (someone who checks grammar, spelling, etc.) I'd come across looking like a boob! Yet I consider myself to be fluent in English.

From a "speaking English" standpoint, I'd go along with Gekkosan.

Cheers

updated Feb 1, 2012
posted by mtmonadnock
Everybody needs a good editor, huh? At least you realize it Frank. - Pablo-Peligroso, Feb 1, 2012
2
votes

I hear you, kd.... I felt kind of strange saying I'm "fluent" in English. However, it is the language that I learned from infancy forward, living in an English speaking country.
I can converse in English just fine... at least in my neck of the woods! But I am far from being perfect in English grammar, written or spoken! So, does that mean I am NOT 'fluent' in English?
Good question.

updated Jan 31, 2012
posted by Gillygaloo
1
vote

Hello kdrinning:

I believe that it is really difficult to be fluent in any language. I think that to be fluent, you have to know how to say not only what you want or need to say, but pretty much anything that can be said.

I think you might be confusing "fluency" with "being coordinated", possible?

There are people who are gifted at "gabbing"/"writing" but are not more or less fluent than those that are not that gifted in those skills.

I totally agree with farallon7

Do I make sense?

updated Feb 1, 2012
edited by chileno
posted by chileno
You make perfect sense. Thanks for your input. Everyone has really made me think and I will re-evaluate my position on fluency because of the wise words from this group. - kdrinning, Jan 31, 2012
possibly* - Goldie_Miel, Feb 1, 2012
1
vote

I have been learning five different languages right now, and I would say I am fluent ENOUGH in Spanish. The problem with Spanish, though, is that there are so many regions in the world that speak a different Spanish. I live in the US, so you would think that I would understand the Spanish-speaking people of Mexico; however, they are quite a bit more difficult to understand than Puerto Ricans or Spaniards (the two I have had most experience with). However, if I can understand enough to not be confused in a conversation, then I would say that is fluency ENOUGH. I would love to learn the in's and out's of the language, but I'm afraid that really isn't possible for somebody that is country-bound.

updated Feb 1, 2012
posted by Der_Kirby
1
vote

If you can function in a language environment to handle most of your needs, i would say you are fluent in that language. Since most of us cannot move to a new country to learn their language, I would say focus more on getting functional in the language first, rather than worrying about being "correct" all the time.

updated Feb 1, 2012
posted by JazSpanish
1
vote

To me being fluent is being able to communicate in another language without too much thought, in such a way that it wouldn't be obvious to a native speaker that you are still learning the language.

You might still have a recognisably 'foreign' accent but you will be able to form sentences comfortably and have sufficient vocabulary to converse on most subjects. Some of the Spanish speakers on here are certainly close to fluency in English. I don't know about those learning Spanish, my own isn't good enough to tell.

updated Jan 31, 2012
posted by MaryMcc
1
vote

I tend to agree with you Kdrinning. I expect that someone fluent in a language can say just about anything, pronounce words correctly, and have good grammar. Of course with those standards, I've met more than a few native English speakers who are not fluent. Flustrated instead of frustrated, libery instead of library.

updated Jan 31, 2012
posted by Leatha
If that is so (and I'm not saying this is an invalid argument), then we'd probably have to consider that a vast portion of the population speaking any given language is *not* fluent. Only a few true masters of the language could be considered "fluent". - Gekkosan, Jan 31, 2012
But come to think of it then, isn't *that* what the word "master" is for? - Gekkosan, Jan 31, 2012
0
votes

I think fluency is something difficult but achievable by many with sufficient effort.

I would want to be able to listen, speak, write and read with ease before considering myself fluent. The content involved can be anything non-technical in nature, or if technical, related to my field of work. And when I come across any word or phrase I don't understand, fluency will mean all I need is a dictionary in the same language, or an encyclopedia. smile

Another aspect of fluency would mean being able to speak consistently in one language, no matter how many I know. I wouldn't consider myself fluent yet if I get stuck mid-sentence trying to figure out how to say a particular word in the language I'm using, all the time knowing how to say it in the other languages I happen to also know.

updated Jan 31, 2012
posted by mathslover