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Few commas in Spanish (to indicate a pause)

Few commas in Spanish (to indicate a pause)

9
votes

What seems to frustrate me the most with spanish, is its commarules, where there in some sentences, isn't commas in the middle of two parts of the sentence, like one's used to in English and other languages. Am I the only one thinking like this? To me, it would be more natural to have a centence like this: Cuando hace calor, hay que beber mucho instead of Cuando hace calor hay que beber mucho. There's no pause in the sentence and therefore it could be difficult to imply where the pause should be, especially if you don't know Spanish to well. I mean, in English and many other languages, this sentence consists of two parts, the first "when it's hot", (pause) and the second "you have to drink a lot" Is there any reason why it's like this, or is it "just because"? Would it be wrong of me to actually put a comma in there, or would that be a no-no! ? To me, comma simplify a sentence and its meaning.

6956 views
updated Feb 15, 2016
edited by inridk
posted by inridk
"Sentence", please. - Gekkosan, Jan 16, 2012
Different languages have different comma rules. If you learn spanish punctuation it will help you understand a sentence better. If you learn Czech comma rules your head will explode. - rabbitwho, Jan 16, 2012
if you don't know Spanish 'toO' well :) - Kiwi-Girl, Jan 16, 2012
Don't worry, I'm Spanish and I feel just the same with English, I never know where I have to put the commas (and sometimes I doubt with my Spanish commas too) :) - Cordobesa, Jan 16, 2012
Hehe, good to know. Apparantly there's very different comma rules, so I better try follow up with the commarules of the respective languages :) - inridk, Jan 17, 2012

10 Answers

8
votes

The skill of oratory as it relates to the so-called "Western tradition"—and in particular to the effective use of pauses and rests to provide emphasis and other effects—is at least partially rooted in historical techniques that have largely been passed on to us through the lens of ancient Greek and Roman texts. Due to the fact that there is at least some commonality between English and Spanish in this regard, it should not be too surprising to see some overlap in the way that these artifacts of older languages become apparent in our modern languages.

Nevertheless, each respective language has also gone through its own unique developmental process, a centuries long process in the case of Spanish and English, and as such, each language makes use of punctuation in a manner which reflects the natural flow of that particular language. While the norms of Spanish and English orthography are very similar in many respects, there are some notable differences.

As I am sure you are aware, all languages exhibit their own natural rhythm and meter, and though it might seem convenient to superimpose the rhythm scheme of a language with which we are more familiar upon that of an unfamiliar language, I would caution that such an endeavor is bound to lead to disappointment.

In the end, it would be far better to try to seek out examples of "well-spoken" Spanish, develop an ear for its rhythm, and use this as a framework upon which to hang the rules of punctuation, rules which, not incidentally, should be learned on a language-by-language basis.

In regards to the specific use of the comma in Spanish, you might find this link helpful: DPD entry for coma

updated Feb 15, 2016
posted by Izanoni1
Very well written response. Thank you. - gringojrf, Jan 16, 2012
Excellent! - samdie, Jan 16, 2012
!! - territurtle, Jan 16, 2012
7
votes

Well, of course every language has its rules, and internalizing them is half the battle to learning that language. The funny thing is, concerning the example about which you complain, you are wrong - which is to say right. There should be a comma in this sentence, according to the rules of Spanish smile as follows:

Cuando hace calor, hay que beber mucho.

Among other things, commas are used

"To separate adverbs or adverbial phrases that affect the meaning of the entire sentence from the rest of the sentence: Such words and phrases often come at the beginning of a sentence, although they can also be inserted.

Por supuesto, no puedo comprenderlo. Of course, I can't understand it."

Please read the following article, and good luck with your Spanish!

Commas in Spanish

updated Feb 15, 2016
posted by Jeremias
Thank you, I'll read it =) - inridk, Jan 16, 2012
Didn't read it until now, but it made a lot of sense. Thanks again. - inridk, Jan 17, 2012
7
votes

A few of the responses to this question have rubbed me the wrong way. I found NOTHING offensive about the question.

The author noticed something (which I have also noticed) and wanted clarification. An example was given along with an explanation of the authors own thoughts on the subject.

If the author said something in which you did not like, don’t you think it would have been better to answer the question and then ask, “what do you mean” or “can you clarify?” instead of what appeared to me as an attack.

Did “I must wonder just how much exposure you have had to Spanish literature, that you feel compelled to make such a peculiar affirmation” really need to be added to one of the responses? I don’t think the author was referring to Spanish literature.

This site may promote proper spelling, grammar, and punctuation but others do not. I have seen many sentences run on and on. Of course that happens in other languages but let's face it, we're not learning those other languages (or maybe you are) so many of the problems are going to stand out and seem more frequent.

In my opinion, what you are doing is making it so that those who want to know something will not ask for fear of ridicule or looking stupid.

I know I will think twice about posting another question!

updated Jan 18, 2012
posted by Joey-Jones
oh please don't be shy to ask questions, Gekko is a big softie really, I think he just ate something that disagreed with him this morning, too much fruit perhaps ;) So ask away! and ps I like your reason for learning Spanish :) - Kiwi-Girl, Jan 16, 2012
Thank you Kiwi_Girl! - Joey-Jones, Jan 17, 2012
I did not, and I stand by what I wrote - which, considering how it struck me, I think was perfectly polite and even handed. I believe it is important to think about how one phrases one's questions and replies. As I wrote in my post, I see nothing wrong.. - Gekkosan, Jan 17, 2012
...with the core question. It is perfectly fine to question the writing style of a person who misuses punctuation. I agree that this is an annoying problem. But I stand by my belief and my statement that bad writing has nothing to do with the writer's ... - Gekkosan, Jan 17, 2012
...language. It is very much a matter of personal skill and training. To generalize that Spanish writers (all of them!) use commas poorly, is a totally inadequate statement. Offensive, because it implies that Spanish writers are unable to write properly, - Gekkosan, Jan 17, 2012
simply because they are Spanish. - Gekkosan, Jan 17, 2012
Now, Inridk explained very nicely what she meant, and I am satisfied with that. Your comment, though, following the discussion, I'm afraid I find a bit more disturbing. - Gekkosan, Jan 17, 2012
Now, I didn't mean Spanish writers in general, rather the rules. I pointed that out to you clearly. So please stop complaining about me saying otherwise. And about that last comment to Joey, please, it's unnecessary. - inridk, Jan 17, 2012
I am at peace with you, Inridk. Besides, you are a colleague, and that means a lot to me. My first response was to your original title, which you gratefully changed, and to the following statement: "is their poor use its commarules", which you also.. - Gekkosan, Jan 17, 2012
..changed later. I acknowledge that one of the *Big* problems of this limited medium is that is it very easy to misinterpret the meaning of a comment. To me, it was important to point out the way your initial comment came across when I read it. - Gekkosan, Jan 17, 2012
You clarified, and I am fine with that. I think the discussion was necessary because sometimes we can offend without meaning to. We have had members in this Forum whom I know would have taken deep offense at your original statement, and would have been - - Gekkosan, Jan 17, 2012
...far less polite with their comments. I believe, in any event, that your original post was, perhaps, unfortunately worded and, as I said, we got over that already. - Gekkosan, Jan 17, 2012
I now know which site I won't be using anymore. Gekkosan, it appears to me that you are one of those sensative types. The kind that finds flaws in anything and everything. First you didn't like the question that was presented. - Joey-Jones, Jan 18, 2012
and now you don't like my reaction to your response that doesn't agree with your ideas. You need to take a question at face value and quit trying to guess what was implied. - Joey-Jones, Jan 18, 2012
To anyone else who may be sensative...I am in no way impying that ALL Spanish speakers or writer look too deeply into things, just Gekkosan.. - Joey-Jones, Jan 18, 2012
6
votes

I know what you mean, (although you may want to edit out the 'poor' use of commas; bit je je) - but it's true that there definitely seem to be fewer commas used in Spanish. I've become so used to it now that I'm starting to forget to use them where I should in English, lol smile But I don't think that anyone is going to pull you up for popping an extra comma in where you fancy so I'd say go ahead!

The article Iza provided is a good overview of some of the differences between English and Spanish when it comes to commas but as you've seen discussed here each language has it's own peculiarities which don't necessarily make them better or worse, just different, so we just have to embrace the funny little things like this that we come across. I find it's better if we don't sweat the small stuff too much. There are far more important things that you can't get away with, like the subjunctive and when to chose ser over estar je je wink

updated Jan 18, 2012
edited by Kiwi-Girl
posted by Kiwi-Girl
Thank you for your response. I believe my updated title should feel less offensive. And of course, that's not how I meant it to be (offensive, I mean) - inridk, Jan 17, 2012
Inridk, I really, really didnät mean to offend and I donät think anybody else did either. Lo siento. - annierats, Jan 17, 2012
Sorry, these typos were due to the machine being in Swedish, oh god...typos, typos. - annierats, Jan 17, 2012
de nada - I think the first line is where you have the problem jeje ;) 'poor' - Kiwi-Girl, Jan 17, 2012
6
votes

I ...am frankly not quite sure about how to respond to this post.

I agree that badly used punctuation is annoying; perhaps you have noticed that we are constantly asking our members to use proper grammar, punctuation and capitalization for their posts.

However, I have a very strong objection to your gross generalization that Spanish writers use commas poorly. There are style rules in Spanish, just as there are in English. They are slightly different, mind you, and what passes as a good sentence in English is not necessarily good in Spanish - and vice versa. Good writers make good use of punctuation, and poor writers can be spotted by their awkward, messy sentences. This, in my view, has nothing to do with the language, but with the training and skill of the writer.

I think your post would have been perfectly acceptable if you had left it as a complaint about "The poor use of commas." Period. However when you state that Spanish writers, in general, do not use punctuation appropriately, your statement falls somewhere between ignorance and offense. I must wonder just how much exposure you have had to Spanish literature, that you feel compelled to make such a peculiar affirmation.

updated Jan 17, 2012
posted by Gekkosan
No no, just a small frustration of the language rules itself. I know they use commas, and I do understand a lot of it when there's no comma, it would just sometimes make it easier with that comma. - inridk, Jan 16, 2012
I see now that I can be misunderstood with what I wrote, so I can understand your reaction. - inridk, Jan 16, 2012
I don't think there's more than one way to take "poor use of commas" inridk, what you said was offensive. - rabbitwho, Jan 16, 2012
I'm sorry, I didn't mean it that way. The meaning of poor in my language is apparantly not what it's like in English. - inridk, Jan 17, 2012
"Poor" means "worse than is usual, expected, or desirable; of a low or inferior standard or quality" I appreciate your clarifications. - Gekkosan, Jan 17, 2012
5
votes

I must agree with Joey-Jones here. I have had it happen to me, and have seen it happen to others. Someone (often with little knowledge of English, and even less of Spanish) asks a question or makes an observation and is met with personal criticism of the "Well! I don't know how you got that idea! (you insufferable idiot!)" type. sick

Sorry fellow SD enthusiasts, but this is true - especially of many of those who are (and/or consider themselves to be) best able to help us ignoramuses. Some of the students here are not native English-speakers; if you can understand them at all, they should be only gently corrected. And, yes, much Spanish writing is woefully short of good comma usage, just as much English writing is (recall the book titled, "Eats, Shoots and Leaves").

updated Jan 17, 2012
posted by Lector_Constante
1
vote

This is even better

updated Feb 15, 2016
posted by ray76
1
vote

The comma doesn't just indicate a pause, it sets the introductory phrase or clause apart and a comma IS used, both in English and Spanish.

updated Sep 28, 2012
posted by ksmith517
True. - annierats, Sep 28, 2012
I do know that, and have learned a lot since I posted this post over 8 months ago, and I feel more confident on when to use a comma in Spanish now than I was then.Luckily ;) - inridk, Sep 28, 2012
1
vote

I have to say I agree with Gekkosan. Good writing is good writing, in whatever language. Personally, if in doubt, I try to read a sentence aloud, that often tells me if a comma is needed or not. I agree they can make huge difference but I hadn't really thought of them as being very different in Spanish. You have introduced a new worry into my life!

updated Jan 17, 2012
edited by annierats
posted by annierats
1
vote

So, where is a good place to learn the Spanish rules on commas?

updated Jan 16, 2012
posted by kdrinning
Here's a general article on punctuation that you might enjoy :) http://spanish.about.com/od/writtenspanish/a/punctuation.htm - Kiwi-Girl, Jan 16, 2012
and here's another about commas - http://translation-blog.trustedtranslations.com/commas-in-english-and-spanish-2009-04-20.html - Kiwi-Girl, Jan 16, 2012