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G A M E Ser y Estar en el pasado

G A M E Ser y Estar en el pasado

15
votes

How to play:

1) Translate the given sentence using ser or estar in the appropriate past tense.

Bear in mind that there will often be more than one 'correct' anwer but try to convey the meaning of the author.

2) Give the reason why you chose that particular verb and tense.

then

3) Leave another short sentence that includes the English verb 'to be' (which can be translated with either ser or estar) describe something in the past.

finally

4) If necessary supply some context to allow the next person to convey your exact meaning.

I shall start us off: smile

Given:

Charlotte Bronte was an English novelist and poet.

Context:

This is the opening line of a biography with lots of info to follow.

Translated:

Reason:

I chose to use _________ because ..........

12033 views
updated Oct 1, 2012
posted by Kiwi-Girl

36 Answers

7
votes

Charlotte Bronte was an English novelist and poet.

Charlotte Bronte fue una novelista y poeta inglesa.

Fue because she is dead and she always was a novelist and poet, and that did not change. Era would indicate that she is no longer a novelist and poet.

Your father was a good man.

Context: None needed right?

updated Jan 12, 2012
edited by jeezzle
posted by jeezzle
oh I knew this was going to get tricky - you see I would have used era - because I want to carry on talking about her whereas fue feels like the end of the story; lol I think I better find us a moderator je je :) - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
Vicente Fox fue presidente antes de Felipe Calderón. This was a term that started and stopped, but with Charlotte Bronte, the speaker has to determine if her profession was an ongoing part of her life (era) or not (fue) - 005faa61, Oct 10, 2011
Right, because I assume she lived and died a novelist. To assume she at some point, no longer was a novelist seems really odd to me. - jeezzle, Oct 10, 2011
Tu padre era un buen hombre, tu padre fue un buen hombre. WIth the second we know he was a good man, with the first we must assume that at some point he became a bad man or was no longer considered good. - jeezzle, Oct 10, 2011
No Kiwi, era is incorrect there. Era means that she DID stop being a novelist. - jeezzle, Oct 10, 2011
no it's the other way around or am I going crazy? man I hope it's you Jeezle lol - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
Is "The frog lived in a swamp" your sentence for translation? It does not contain anything that would translate to ser or estar. - eeeickythump, Oct 10, 2011
ja ja this is hilarious - good point eeeickythump - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
Kiwi....... look here: http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlotte_Brontë - jeezzle, Oct 10, 2011
You have it backwards or you don't understand it correctly. Fue means a permanent state while era means "used to be" and no longer is, like "tu padre era hombre" means he likely had a sex change at some point while "fue un hombre" means he was a man. - jeezzle, Oct 10, 2011
exactly - they used fue because the gave the dates of her life - stating an end - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
Nope. It's because she is dead. Era would mean she is or was no longer a novelist and that changed about her. - jeezzle, Oct 10, 2011
you can use fue or era but in my example I'm not stating anything about timing, I'm just giving a description of her in the past so I'm using the imperfect. - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
look at this http://www.lapatilla.com/site/2011/09/30/el-era-wilfredo-el-chofer-que-murio-en-el-choque-de-trenes-de-los-valles-del-tuy-foto/ - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
era - talking about a dead man - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
Do as you wish, and that is incorrect. You're saying she used to be a novelist and that changed about her using imperfect. - jeezzle, Oct 10, 2011
lol let's go for the record of the most comments ever on one post, je je - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
Did you look at that news clipping? era talking about a dead man, doesn't that ruin your theory? - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
no I'm not saying that changed about her, I'm just not saying. Vivía en un pantano. Imperfect - he used to live there, he may still do or he may not but that's not important in that sentence - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
Vivía en un pantano. Imperfect - that is correct but it's different than your other sentence. - jeezzle, Oct 10, 2011
Cuando era niño, jugaba a la bestia. This time period began and stopped, but it was an ongoing part of my life. If you want to emphasize writing being just a phase in Bronte´s life, then use "fue." If empasizing who she was as a person, use "era" - 005faa61, Oct 10, 2011
I disagree Julian, because I have had this conversations with the natives at work and gone over this very well. To say "Era X" means no longer, there was a change. Mi coche era bueno. Now it isn't. Mi coche fue bueno. My car always was good. - jeezzle, Oct 10, 2011
She always was a novelist. She died a novelist. No change = fue. - jeezzle, Oct 10, 2011
Another example: Diego Rivera, quien era un gran pintor, fue el amante de Frida Kahlo antes de casarse con ella, hasta dos veces - 005faa61, Oct 10, 2011
You can use era as well. I mean, if she's dead, she's no longer a novelist, because she's dead! She can't right anymore.. So that's the point about why you cau use both verbs - ale_rd, Oct 10, 2011
Diego Rivera, quien fue un gran pintor, era el amante de Frida Kahlo antes de casarse con ella - jeezzle, Oct 10, 2011
Sorry, write, not right haha - ale_rd, Oct 10, 2011
well I would think era, but voyage_voyage says it should be fue. he didn't have the whole post to look at, but based off of "she was an english poet" - unMica, Oct 10, 2011
Jeezzle, don´t forget to consider the source. I am currently working with some Mexican guys while finishing the construction of my house and they are constantly saying "pipa" while talking about plumbing, and this is absolutely wrong. - 005faa61, Oct 10, 2011
"Pipa" is the thing one smokes. "Tubo" is "pipe." I have corrected them, as I am a half-native as Heidita says, but they are accustomed to their incorrect usage - 005faa61, Oct 10, 2011
Well you do have a point with that Juilian. They say "troca" for truck around here all the time. - jeezzle, Oct 10, 2011
Thanks Mica ;) - jeezzle, Oct 10, 2011
So now I'm confused as well. I'm reading a passage from a textbook and it says: "Los incas fueron el pueblo americano," but then switches into the imperfect to say, "Vivían... y hablaban..." So, why did they use 'fueron' and not 'eran'?? - RosaVerde, Oct 10, 2011
Well if I'm looking at this correctly, they used fueron because they are stressing the end of their existence rather than use era to just describe how they were in the past. :) - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
Ah, so if the incas still existed today, then it would be 'era' (assuming they had changed from being that way), am I understanding correctly? 'Fue' emphasizes that they have died out and thus always existed in that state? - RosaVerde, Oct 10, 2011
So wait, maybe I'm understanding your and Julian's points. 'Era' signifies more of an active pursuit, whereas 'fue' was more of an unchanging state of being? - RosaVerde, Oct 10, 2011
it doesn't have to be death, it can just be that you want to encapsulate what happened into a time period or you want to refer to the beginning or end of something - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
it's easier to give examples with estar - estaba feliz (I was happy/ongoing) estuve feliz (I was happy for a certain time, which you might state like 'yesterday', but you're letting us know that it wasn't ongoing you're viewing that state as over. - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
at least that's my understanding but I still have much to learn :) - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
Ah, got it, I see now. Thanks for the tips. =) - RosaVerde, Oct 10, 2011
de nada :) - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
For goodness sake, what a silly, mad debate! People, Jeezle is right. Bronte - Gekkosan, Oct 11, 2011
...fue una escritora, y sus novelas eran insoportables. Fue. She's long dead. She's no more. Fue, people! - Gekkosan, Oct 11, 2011
Esta es la prueba que el uso corecto de "ser" y "estar" es muy confundiendo! - MLucie, Oct 11, 2011
"es muy confuso", MLucie. :-) - Gekkosan, Oct 11, 2011
Gracias Gekkosan! - MLucie, Oct 18, 2011
5
votes

To clarify on whether Brontë fue or era:

Strictly in the context given:

Charlotte Brontë was an English novelist and poet.

The only possible option is "fue". She was, firmly in the preterite. She's passed on. She's no more. She's given up her mortal coil, etc.

Are there contexts where "era" is a likely choice? Yes of course, but you must provide that context:

Las hermanas Brontë fueron reconocidas escritoras del siglo XIX. Charlotte era novelista, y la mayor. Emily era poetisa y Anne, la menor, era ensayista (I'm just making this up, not trying to be historically accurate here). Las tres tenían un hermano que era pintor.

Las hermanas Brontë se destacaron por sus escritos melodramáticos, sacarinos e insoportables. Charlotte fue culpable de perpetrar el texto de tortura Jane Eyre, pero fue superada con creces por Emily, cuando escribió la putrefacta Wuthering Heights, para eterno horror de la humanidad.

updated Oct 21, 2011
edited by Gekkosan
posted by Gekkosan
hehe :) You are sooooo right - cogumela, Oct 11, 2011
Her mortal coil...that's awesome! - MattM, Oct 18, 2011
5
votes

Clarification:

Those boys were very naughty last night.

Ser travieso: ser inquieto y revoltoso

Anoche esos chicos fueron muy traviesos.

Anoche esos chicos eran muy traviesos

Not posible. It could be: Los chicos eran muy traviesos hace unos años (but now, they are not)


Estar travieso: mostrar un comportamiento inquieto y revoltoso en un determinado momento (Los chicos son por lo general tranquilos, pero ayer estaban/estuvieron traviesos)

Esos chicos estaban muy traviesos ayer por la noche.

Esos chicos estuvieron muy traviesos ayer por la noche.


Given:

The movie was an all-time hit!

La película fue un éxito total.


New sentence:

It's been wonderful knowing you.

updated Oct 21, 2011
edited by cogumela
posted by cogumela
so you can use travieso with estar? ay ay ay - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 11, 2011
have a look at the conversation under Geouk's post - I thought I was losing my mind ja ja - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 11, 2011
Gracias Cogumela. Fueron traviesos, of course, sounds absolutely horrible and makes no sense at all. - Gekkosan, Oct 11, 2011
muchísimas gracias :) - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 11, 2011
4
votes

Just filling the gap here smile

Given sentence:

The movie was an all-time hit!

(not your particular opionion, the whole world thinks so)

updated Oct 21, 2011
edited by Kiwi-Girl
posted by Kiwi-Girl
4
votes

Given:

Your father was a good man.

Translated:

Tu padre fue un buen hombre. (if i was at his funeral merely passing a comment about his passing)

Tu padre era un buen hombre que ....... (if I'm about to tell a story about
something great that he did)

New Sentence:

Those boys were very naughty last night.

updated Oct 21, 2011
edited by Kiwi-Girl
posted by Kiwi-Girl
4
votes

Dinner was delicious last night.

I would say "La cena estuvo deliciosa anoche."

Your father was a good man.

updated Oct 21, 2011
edited by jeezzle
posted by jeezzle
so why did you put fue? I'm pretty sure it has to be estaba or estuvo but you can't use ser there - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
But for some reason I thought this game was about preterite VS imperfect. Changed it to estuvo. Fue does work though but has a different meaning, if I have that right. - jeezzle, Oct 10, 2011
When followed by an adjective, usually estar is correct. When followed by a noun, usually go with ser. - Jeremias, Oct 10, 2011
That's a very good point Jeremias :) - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
I like estaba better Jeezle but estuvo does work - it's just the difference between perspective (if I'm looking at it correctly) with estaba you're relieving the moment as if you were there, with estuvo you're looking back on the deliciousness as a - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
completed event kind of thing :) - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
The dinner came and went. Jeezzle is right with "estuvo." He is not commenting on the general nature of the food, but on its taste last night. In other words, it could have been terrible, but it wasn´t - 005faa61, Oct 10, 2011
This sort of thing gives the listener a direct opinion / interpretation of the speaker - 005faa61, Oct 10, 2011
I'm digging my toes in on this one, I'd say both work - it might be regional that you'd be more likely to say estuvo but I reckon estaba is just as good - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
(if not better je je) :p - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
MC, many times there is more than just one option. It depends on the speaker´s perception of events - 005faa61, Oct 10, 2011
exactly :) - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
I was only teasing about the 'if not better' comment lol as I said I think estuvo and estaba works here dependent only on your perspective - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
4
votes

I am starting a new answer because the comments in the previous answer were demasiado y demasiados (un chiste smile)

You can use fue or era in describing the deceased Charlotte Bronte as a novelist and poet. There are differences in sensibility, which I frankly don't completely understand, but I think native Spanish speakers get confused here as well. Check out this thread:

Era v Fue

and you'll see what I mean.

updated Oct 21, 2011
posted by Jeremias
thanx Jere, that's exactly why I started this game je je :) If natives go either way for sometimes an unknown reason us learners are bound to have trouble! - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
But I've had so many talks about this I feel like I know it even if there are some twists and turns. Mi perro fue leal = my dog was loyal.always until he dead, never unloyal. Mi perro era leal means he stopped being loyal at some point. No more. - jeezzle, Oct 10, 2011
just think about the imperfect tense for a minute, forgetting about ser and estar - the whole use of that tense indicates something that is ongoing and not completed - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
Ok Kiwi, so how do you say "My dog was loyal"? Just curious how you would say it. ;) - jeezzle, Oct 10, 2011
Jeezle, you are being overly rule-driven which is very unlike you :). I agree with you about mi perro era leal, but I think most people would say CB era una novelista. Not the same logic. - Jeremias, Oct 10, 2011
I don't know Jeremias. I really think "fue una novelista" works so much better there but I'm sure they could both work. I am trying focus more on little things since that thread the other day. - jeezzle, Oct 10, 2011
era leal if I was just describing it but if I was giving a eulogy I'd use fue je je :) - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
because my perspective would be changing from remembering the ongoing loyalty of the dog (even if it had died in the meantime), to viewing it's life as over and that being the whole point of my mentioning it's loyalty - if that makes any sense lol - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
Kiwi, I love this...but I've been so busy reading the comments that I don't have time to play1 - MLucie, Oct 11, 2011
ja ja tell me about it! - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 11, 2011
4
votes

Very clever eeeickythump a double up smile

Given Sentence:

When I was a child, I was often unwell.

Translated:

Cuando era niña a menudo estaba enferma.

Reason:

Era for descriptions in the past and estar/imp for states in the past.

New sentence:

Dinner was delicious last night.

updated Oct 21, 2011
edited by Kiwi-Girl
posted by Kiwi-Girl
...estaba enferma (gender) - cogumela, Oct 11, 2011
ah silly me lolz, gracias chica :) - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 11, 2011
4
votes

The frog lived in a swamp.

La rana vivía en el pantano. (unfortunately there's no ser or estar in this sentence.)

Imperfect tense used because we are describing "the way things were" over a period of time in the past, rather than describing a specific event.

My sentence:

When I was a child, I was often unwell.

updated Oct 21, 2011
posted by eeeickythump
good on you keeping the game going, don't mind us lol :) - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
This can go either way, depending on context. La rana vivió toda su vida en el pantano. La rana vivía en el pantano antes de mudarse al castillo de la princesa. - Gekkosan, Oct 11, 2011
3
votes

Given:

Matt was trying to provide us with a sentence which contained ser or estar in the past.

Translated:

Matt estaba intentando proporcionarnos una oración que contenga ser o estar en el pasado.

Reason:

Past progressive = estar in the imperfect + present participle smile

New Sentence:

He was handsome but he was also very mean.

updated Oct 21, 2011
edited by Kiwi-Girl
posted by Kiwi-Girl
3
votes

Hi KiwiGirl

BlockNew Sentence:

Those boys were very naughty last night. quote

The conumdrum of preterite vs past imperfect. It depends on the context, as it stands in this sentence it is:

"Aquellos niños estuvieron muy traviesos anoche".

By saying "los niños estaban muy traviesos anoche" there's continuation to the action that suggests "and then what happened?"

updated Oct 21, 2011
posted by geouk
you've got it :) and a new sentence for the next person? - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
Oh..it was a game! I thought It was a question...;) - geouk, Oct 10, 2011
Their overall personalities are not being described here plus, "travieso" is not a state of being, hence "fueron" is correct - 005faa61, Oct 10, 2011
no way! ru kidding JC? because it has anoche we know that we're talking about a state in a particular time we're not classifying the children as being inherently naughty children - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
"Travieso" is an adjective, the same as "Niños traviesos." The only way to use "estar" would be something like "Los niños estuvieron bien metidos en travesuras anoche" - 005faa61, Oct 10, 2011
wow this is really interesting! yr the bomb - I'm off to investigate je je - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
so just to get this straight you can say está traviesa but not estaba traviesa? - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
No. To use "travieso," you need "ser" just as you would with "niño," "sirena," etc. - 005faa61, Oct 10, 2011
guau I never knew that - to me the word naughty is generally describing behaviour more than a personality trait so I would have gone for estar - the things ya learn! - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 11, 2011
so anyways Geouk ru going to give us a new sentence? anything in the past using 'to be' :) - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 11, 2011
No new sentence? I'm joining the indignados protesting on the streets! - rabbitwho, Oct 11, 2011
Please see Cogumela's post regarding this. "Fueron traviesos" in this context is NOT correct. Lost niños estuvieron traviesos anoche is the only option. - Gekkosan, Oct 11, 2011
ah thank goodness, I thought I was definitely loosing my mind! mil gracias Gekko :) - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 11, 2011
There is a distinctive difference between "ser travieso" and "estar travieso", the former is a trait of personality, the latter is a behaviour...in context: "como se comportaron anoche?" Answer: "Estuvieron traviesos"...no hint of doubt on this one - geouk, Oct 11, 2011
exacto, estoy de acuerdo Geo, sorry JC I'm not quite sure what's happened there. - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 11, 2011
3
votes

Cuando era niño estaba enfermo a menudo

updated Oct 21, 2011
posted by StAndrew
snap - well done :) don't forget to leave a new sentence too :) - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 10, 2011
2
votes

Given: I chose for this sentence to be a little easier than the last one had been.

answer: Elegí que esta frase fuese un poco más facíl que ha sido la última.

Reason: Wow, the grammatical part. Well, I know by heart that you say "es faciíl" so I used ser. And the ser for ha sido .. well I chose it because....... it is a permanant state of "the last one" (?)

new sentence: I has been ten years since I have been in France.

updated Oct 21, 2011
edited by dewclaw
posted by dewclaw
you have a couple of la últimas in there Dew je je :) - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 18, 2011
...que esta frase fuera / fuese. Fácil. And Kiwi's comment, of course. - Gekkosan, Oct 19, 2011
2
votes

Given Sentence:

The place was very dark.

El lugar era muy oscuro.

Reason: describing a scene in the past.

New sentence:

My father was a civil engineer in the Navy.

updated Oct 21, 2011
posted by sanlee
Hey Sandy, well done :) - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 12, 2011
Thanks, Kiwi! - sanlee, Oct 12, 2011
2
votes

Given Sentence:

My father was a civil engineer in the Navy.

Translated:

Mi padre fue ingeniero civil en la Armada.

New sentence:

Who was the best in the competition?

updated Oct 21, 2011
posted by Ashis
very good :) - Kiwi-Girl, Oct 12, 2011