Is the subjunctive used correctly in this example?

Question

"Ella estuvo pensando en todas las cosas malas que le hiciera." "She was thinking about all the bad things he might do to her." (There is uncertainty/doubt as to whether he will really do them.)

Was the sunjunctive of "hacer" used properly in the sentence? If not, what tense/mood should it be in?

Answer 1

Hi, jerry!

I'd use conditional or imperfect, for the things he might do (in the same moment she is thinking and from that point on), if he wanted:

(Ella) Estuvo pensando en todas las cosas malas que él podría hacerle.

(Ella) Estuvo pensando en todas las cosas malas que él podía hacerle

Being the first choice slightly more uncertain.

And, for the things he could have done in the past, but he did not:

(Ella) Estuvo pensando en todas las cosas malas que él podía/podría haberle hecho.

Jerry, Cogumela is a native speaker and one of our resident experts. Go with whatever she writes!! - territurtle, Sep 25, 2011

@Cogumela: Why use the pretérito, when in English we do not know if she ever stopped thinking it and I thought there were only four "progressive tenses" in Spanish, so you could only use (3rd, sing.) está, estaba, estará and estaría? Please explain? - territurtle, Sep 25, 2011

Since we don't know if she stopped thinking it, preterite is valid....and so is imperfect. I have no information, so I kept jerry's example. - cogumela, Sep 25, 2011

Answer 2

Good question Terri - I was wondering the same thing as I would definitely lean toward 'estaba pensando' instead of 'estuvo' - is it just the difference between viewing the whole scenario as finished thus putting it into the preterite?

Let's try to shed some light over the use of 'estaba' and 'estuve'. It is a tricky one though, so down to semantics, without being too technical, it works like this:

Estaba... related to the circumstances the person was in. e.g. "Estaba (él/ella) cocinando cuando sonó el teléfono", "She was cooking when the phone rang".

Estuve...related to a continuous action that ended at some point. "Estuvo (él/ella) cocinando toda la mañana y luego salió", "She cooked all morning and then she left".

There are endless examples for these, if you could come up with a few would be a good exercise and we'll see how they go

hmmm an interesting explanation, gracias :) - Kiwi-Girl, Sep 26, 2011

Thanks so very much for giving such a detailed and clear explanation. Talk about helping someone to learn!! :-> - territurtle, Sep 26, 2011

yes ditto, sorry my comment above didn't sound very gracious at all but it was just because I was trying to 'get' it lol and was a little engrossed in it - but yes, I'm with Terri, thanx heaps, great explanation :) - Kiwi-Girl, Sep 26, 2011

Answer 3

I'll give you the thoughts of the person least qualified on the site to comment!

But I think it does not require the subjunctive because you are stating a fact about what she was thinking. So the indicative mood would be called for.

And since you are using the "past progressive," I suspect you may want to use the imperfect aspect/tense of "estar" (estaba). The imperfect subjunctive of estar would be estuviera (all these in the third person singular, of course (to agree with "she")).

I don't believe there is a "future subjunctive," because we never truly know with absolute certainty what will actually happen. And you put hacer in the imperfect subjunctive, which refers to the past. So I would just put hacer in the plain old vanilla future tense (hará).

Now watch those who know infinitely more than I do tear apart my analyses [I actually look forward to it, because I always learn so much more!]

but don't you think that 'will do' is definite - he will definitely do to her whereas Jerry wanted to say 'might' - might do and may/might is often shown by the use of the subjunctive. I'm not sure but just typing out loud while I think really je je :) - Kiwi-Girl, Sep 25, 2011

on the other hand it may come down to a simple rule about pensar like the one with creer - creer que + indicative, no creer que + subjunctive. - where oh where is Lazarus :( - Kiwi-Girl, Sep 25, 2011

I like your thinking, Kiwi, especially the "creer" rule. Well, my dear, Lazarus is listening to the 60+ entries on your audio thread! ;)) - territurtle, Sep 25, 2011

Yeah!! Looks like we have been saved by Cogumela! - territurtle, Sep 25, 2011

Cogumela and Geouk most certainly did jump right in and come to our resure! (Although I, obviously needed that rescue much more than than you!!) :-) - territurtle, Sep 26, 2011

oh I don't know I think we both have learnt a lot here - great stuff :) - Kiwi-Girl, Sep 26, 2011

Answer 4

Kiwi y terri:

Yo explico muy mal el imperfecto. No me atrevo a contestar porque me temo que os voy a liar más.

Además, no entiendo esto que ha dicho Territurtle:

and I thought there were only four "progressive tenses" in Spanish, so you could only use (3rd, sing.) está, estaba, estará and estaría? Please explain?

Es la primera noticia que tengo. A mí "estuvo pensando" "estuviera pensando" "esté pensando" "ha estado pensando" "había estado pensando" "habrá estado pensando" "habría estado pensando" "haya estado pensando"... me suenan perfectamente. Así que no sé muy bien a qué os referís.

Obviamente, los dos tiempos son posibles en la frase. Al no tener más información sobre el contexto, yo simplemente mantuve el ejemplo de jerry.

Las siguientes frases ya no admiten pretérito:

Estaba pensando en todas las cosas malas.. cuando de repente sonó el teléfono.

Estaba pensando en todas las cosas malas y no le parecía que fueran tan terribles.

Aquel día, mientras tú cocinabas, yo estaba pensando en todas las cosas...

Estas frases ya no admiten imperfecto:

Estuvo pensando en todas las cosas malas toda la noche.

Estuvo pensando en todas las cosas malas, y luego replicó: -de acuerdo.

¡Lamento no poder explicarme mejor! (ni siquiera en español)

You explain magnificently!! Nothing better than examples! ¡Gracias muchisimo, Cogumela! - territurtle, Sep 26, 2011

Well done Cogu - gracias :) I have learnt something - I erroneously thought that if you used the present participle in the past it would have to be with the imperfect to signify ongoing action instead of completed action but I can see from your - Kiwi-Girl, Sep 26, 2011

explanation and Geouk's that it is possible so that's good to know, mil gracias como siempre :) - Kiwi-Girl, Sep 26, 2011

Answer 5

When using "might" as in "...all the bad things he might do to her", the translation to this is "....todas las cosas malas que él podría hacerle" (a ella). Because 'might' is conditional as 'podría'.

If we say "...todas las cosas malas que él podría haberle hecho", in English that is "...all the bad things he might have done to her".

Cheers

Jerry, Geouk is also fluent in *both* languages, so someone to pay attention to! - territurtle, Sep 25, 2011

lol territurtle, thanks for all the advice! - jerryshizzle123, Sep 25, 2011

Thanks Territurtle! One learns lots by trying to help others - geouk, Sep 25, 2011

@Geouk: I thought the conditional tense was used for "things that *might* be done under certain circumstances." I do not understand how her simply "thinking" could create those special circumstances. Please explain? - territurtle, Sep 25, 2011

Well, 'might' is conditional on the basis of uncertainty, 'I might' is inherently conditional. In the sentence above her 'thinking' is not the conditionality, is what happens next which is what he might or might have done - geouk, Sep 25, 2011

Thank goodness, someone who knows what they're talking about - awesome, mil gracias :) - Kiwi-Girl, Sep 25, 2011

Geouk, you really know how to answer a question well!! ¡Gracias muchisimo! - territurtle, Sep 26, 2011

Answer 6

@Cogumela: Why use the pretérito, when in English we do not know if she ever stopped thinking it and I thought there were only four "progressive tenses" in Spanish, so you could only use (3rd, sing.) está, estaba, estará and estaría? Please explain?

Good question Terri - I was wondering the same thing as I would definitely lean toward 'estaba pensando' instead of 'estuvo' - is it just the difference between viewing the whole scenario as finished thus putting it into the preterite?

Answer 7

Edit - incorrect answer, removed so as not to confuse

Correct info gracias a Cogu: (present / might do)

(Ella) Estuvo pensando en todas las cosas malas que él podría hacerle.

(Ella) Estuvo pensando en todas las cosas malas que él podía hacerle

Correct info gracias a Geouk: (past / might have done)

podría haberle hecho =he might have done to her".