Agradezco que + modo indicativo

Question

Hello all,

I was reading an answer given to an earlier thread in which the following expression was recommended:

?Agradezco que la gente de aquí me ayude.

This got me thinking about something I read in the Nueva gramática de la lengua, in which it was suggested that in similar expressions (especially in America) the use of the indicative in the subordinate clause is often acceptable and can be used in order to highlight its informational content.

My problem is that no specific examples were given for this particular verb (agradecer), and I was just wondering whether or not such a sentence would be possible:

?Agradezco que la gente de aquí me ayuda.

In other words, does the use of the indicative in "la gente de aquí me ayuda" (in the sentence above) serve to emphasize the speakers intent to highlight the declarative nature of this statement (i.e. The people here do indeed help me) or would such usage just come off as sounding strange or ungrammatical?

Thanks for any and all help with this

Answer 1

Technically speaking, one does not begin a sentence with "I am grateful that..." to inform others of what you think about the reality, so what follows should just be mentioned, not declared. If you check most book, they'll tell you categorically that subjunctive is required here.

However, people are not grammar books, and the language is subordinate to what they want to say; not the other way around. Consider this sentence:

Agradezco el hecho de que la gente de aquí me ayuda/ayude.

This time, indicative can be used -and it is used- to highlight the fact itself, apart from declaring that you are grateful about it. You'll notice that in this cases, the intonation and the stress in "la gente de aquí ME AYUDA" increases noticeable in common speech, as if you were trying to say "Let me say this again: they DO help me!" In this case, regardless of the grammar, you are indeed communicating your thoughts about the world, so indicative pops out naturally in the mind of a native speaker, who wants to declare that fact, and cares little about the cohesion of the grammatical structure. That "el hecho que" is sometimes taken for granted, and omitted, leaving you with your second sentence, which, if intonated adequately, can be acceptable... in relaxed and informal speech.

However, I wouldn't advise beginners (or intermediate) students who haven't grasped the idea of subjunctive to learn this sort of variations, and stick to simple general guidelines... always keeping in mind that they are generalizations, not mathematical rules. Natives do not chose indicative or subjunctive because the have a W E I R D O in their heads, but because they do want to express their ideas so that they are properly understood, so they are going to pick the mood that best fits their communicative intentions. The subjunctive is more logical than most people think.

By the way, have you purchased the Nueva gramática de la lengua? The full version, or the reduced one? (I've got both)

Thanks for the answer, Laz. I only wish I had the unabridged edition, but for right now, it is out of my price range. In any case, I have certainly enjoyed having the abbreviated edition in my reference library and have gotten quite a bit of use out of - Izanoni1, Aug 6, 2011

...it. - Izanoni1, Aug 6, 2011

Answer 2

Ira, I can´t give you the grammatical reasoning, but after using "Agradezco que...." subjunctive just "sounds right." And the only reason something sounds right is because of how we hear it all our lives.

If you wanted to use indicative, you could say "Agradezco la ayuda que la gente de aquí me da."

Thanks Julian. I really appreciate your help on this. :) - Izanoni1, Aug 6, 2011