The Irish Perfect tenses

Question

I've changed the title to reflect the fact that the below are not new tenses, rather alternative ways of expressing the perfect tenses, that would make little sense were you not to have heard of them...

You'll not likely find this in any text books but for many folks of the Emerald Isle, it is very real.

Whilst travelling through Central America I spend a few months with Mo (real name Mark but he took to telling people that his name was Mohammed and that he was brought up in an orphanage in Halalabad, Pakistan and subsequently moved to Ireland, such is the tedium of answering the what's your name and where are you from questions).

For a while I was stumped when he would say things such as:

I'm just after having lunch.

I'm just after having a nap.

As, in 'normal' English, to be after something means to want something, as in:

I'm after a new pair of shoes.

I'm after tickets to the Weird Al Yankovic concert.

It became clear though that he was talking in the past tense, and, if you think about it, if you have breakfast at 08:50 and it is now 09:00, you are, temporally speaking, after having your breakfast.

The 'Irish past perfect' looks like 'I was just after going for a swim'.

So, if you are planning to go to Ireland, or happen across any Irish who speak as per the above, you will know what they are talking about from the start.

Answer 1

I'm just after having lunch.

I'm open to suggestions for official names for these tenses...

To qualify as a separate verb tense (if I am not mistaken) would require that the lexical verb be combined with an auxiliary verb or that the root verb have some sort of inflectional marker. Unfortunately, the combination "just after" does not qualify for this in either regard. However, as an idiomatic usage it might still be worth analyzing.

Compare the following:

I have just had lunch

I am just after having lunch

I have just finished having lunch

Two things should be apparent, (1). the word "just" acts as an adverb in both sentence and should not be included as part of your proposed verb phrase, and (2). there already exists a tense which performs this function (present perfect).

The fact that the present perfect is the tense which captures this same meaning should illustrate that the combination of "to be just after," or more specifically, the modification of this type of phrase with the phrase "just after," does not effect the tense but rather the aspect of the verb phrase.

Given all of this, I imagine that if you wished to name such a tense, you might call it "the Irishman's present perfect" or maybe "the Mysterious Central American Irish-Pakistani Transplant and His Amazing Present Perfect." Or maybe you could just call it idiomatic...who knows?

Yeah, thinking about it, the constructions have the same meanings as the perfect tenses. I like the idea of 'The Irish perfects' :-) - afowen, Jan 24, 2011

Answer 2

I don't think it's another tense. Can someone please explain?

It's not a tense Johndoe, it's an idiomatic expression that conveys the same sense as the "present perfect" (as alluded to above). ;-) - Izanoni1, Jan 24, 2011

Apparently, it is probably of very little practical value due to the fact of its extremely limited geographic distribution...this might categorize it as best as colloquial speech and at worst, slang. - Izanoni1, Jan 24, 2011

Sorry...I meant to say "at best as colloquial..." - Izanoni1, Jan 24, 2011

Yeah only of use in Ireland or when trying to understand some Irish people. It was a slow news day... - afowen, Jan 24, 2011

This was a 'just out of interest' post... - afowen, Jan 24, 2011

Answer 3

How about "The Irishisms" 1 and 2 and maybe 3 ?

The "am after" can also mean "want" I am after a free beer / Guiness.

Did you only read 1/2 my post :-) - afowen, Jan 24, 2011

Apparently I did. I am not after denying it. - ian-hill, Jan 24, 2011

Answer 4

I find it more difficult to provide an explanation for the normal "to be after something", where the perspective is the opposite.

If you mean in the sense of "to want something" then I would suggest that this expression is probably tied to the idea of "chasing after (pursuing) something."

I am after tickets to the concert. ? I am trying to get/want to obtain tickets to the concert (and I am out actively "chasing after" them trying to find some).

This reminds me of a similar idiomatic expression, which is "to run/chase down something." This expression means to chase after and capture something/someone but is often used figuratively, also—as in the following:

I am trying to run/chase down some tickets to the concert ? I am trying to find and obtain some concert tickets.

However, in the case of run/chase down there is often the implication that the person speaking has at least some clue as to where to look or who to ask in order to find what they are seeking; whereas, this implication is usually absent in the phrase "to be after something."

Snap! - afowen, Jan 24, 2011

Answer 5

Afowen, I'm glad you warned me about that. I have never heard an expression like that. Is that unique to the Emerald Isle?

I've only ever heard it spoken by Irish people. Any I have heard many Irish people not use it. I'd suspect it's a geographical thing. Mo is from Kilkenny, like the beer, nothing to do with South Park... - afowen, Jan 24, 2011

Answer 6

Well... if "after eating" indicates that the meal has finished, and "I am" refers to your current circumstances, I can appreciate the logic of combining the individual meanings: your current circumstances after finishing the meal.

I am here after having lunch = I am (here) after having (finished) my launch

I find it more difficult to provide an explanation for the normal "to be after something", where the perspective is the opposite.

If you use 'to chase after', 'to run after' as a progressive step. 'He is after me', as another, you can see how 'to be after' might have come about from once meaning physically running to get something you want to mean wanting without the previously... - afowen, Jan 24, 2011

... exerted effort. - afowen, Jan 24, 2011

jeje...beat me to it :) - Izanoni1, Jan 24, 2011