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Me and you, you and me?

Me and you, you and me?

2
votes

For a title of a paper I am writing, I want to say something like, Me and Blackey (the name of a dog), or Blackey and me, or something along those lines.

Would it be incorrect to make the title "Yo y Blackey"? I just wanted to check before I print the final copy. Thanks!

6574 views
updated Nov 26, 2010
posted by hihihihihi
Not Me and Blackey - but "Blackey and I" - ian-hill, Nov 25, 2010
No, I do want to use Blackey and Me, because it is a childrens book with the narrator being a little girl, so for my purpose, I would like it to be "Me", Thanks anyways. - hihihihihi, Nov 25, 2010
Ok - I guess :) Not what me would say though :) - ian-hill, Nov 25, 2010
I have seen a childrens book titled "Monkey and Me" - 0097f7e0, Nov 26, 2010

10 Answers

0
votes

Count me as one who thinks the English title should be Blackey and Me. As a book title I cannot imagine calling it Blackey and I, at least not in English.

And, in my view, this has absolutely nothing to do with whether it is a children's book or not. To me it is simple. In this case, the words Blackey and Me are not the subject of a sentence since there is no verb anywhere in the phrase—neither stated nor implied. Therefore, there is no grammatical requirement to choose I or Me and; so, you can choose the one that sounds the best to you and your audience.

Furthermore, titles of this nature (whether for children or for adults) frequently do follow the pattern of So-and-so and Me (like the Marley & Me example provided by chruhlman).

So, no grammar rule rule I know of contradicts titling the book Blackey and Me. In fact, to say Blackey and I (as a title of a work) sounds downright odd to me.

Now, in Spanish, it would be Blackey y Yo. It is not even an option to say Blackey y Me. But that's Spanish, not English. To me, it seems English puts pronouns in the objective case (me) if its relation to a verb is unknown whereas it appears Spanish puts them in the nominative case (yo) instead.

Had you said you were going to title the book Blackey and Me Go on a Hike, I'd be the first to say it should be Blackey and I Go on a Hike. Likewise, had you suggested a title of All about Blackey and I then I would have informed you that it should be All about Blackey and Me, but your title is just Blackey and Me and there is no context to tell if Blackey and Me are performing actions, are having actions performed on them, or are objects of prepositions; so, I can't think of a rule that says you must choose one or the other, but I can say that most people choose ME in such a case, especially when it's the title of a book or movie or whatnot.

I'm not saying no English book or movie in the world might not use "Blackey and I." I'm saying that, in this particular case, I think it is not a question of grammar but of style, and "Blackey and I" (when said without any other context) sounds very formal whereas "Blackey and Me" sounds more warm and informal. Since there is no grammar rule to say you can't, then choose the warmer, more informal-sounding one.

Well, that's my 2 cents.

updated Nov 26, 2010
edited by webdunce
posted by webdunce
Furthermore, the implication (if there is any) is that the title is short for "This is a Story About Blackey and Me," which further supports choosing Blackey and Me over Blackey and I. - webdunce, Nov 26, 2010
Why am I so passionate about this??? - webdunce, Nov 26, 2010
You might call it "Blackey and I" if that particular phrase gets repeated an awful lot in the story...to be kind of poetic or something, I guess. - webdunce, Nov 26, 2010
Thanks for you input, I agree with you! I think I also agree with you that it is neither correct or incorrect at this point, honestly. - hihihihihi, Nov 26, 2010
4
votes

Blackey y Yo sounds nicer.

updated Nov 26, 2010
posted by Echoline
3
votes

'Yo y XXX' sounds really nasty, it is always said 'XXX y yo'.

Incidentally, a very famous book of Spanish literature is titled 'Platero y yo', where Platero is the name of a donkey.

updated Nov 26, 2010
posted by bill1111
I hope hihihihi doesn't overlook the similarity between his own book title and the one you mention here! - webdunce, Nov 26, 2010
That is to say, a Spanish author, who wrote a story about an animal and "me" decided to put the animal first. - webdunce, Nov 26, 2010
Bill, Blackie is a diminutive form of black and is used frequently for pets that are black in color (usually a dog). Is there a Spanish equivalent like, say, Negrito? I would be tempted to put the animal's name in Spanish since it is a children's book. - webdunce, Nov 26, 2010
Well.. 'Negrito' would be fine, if not for the fact that 'negrito' is -at least in some contexts- similar to the N word. 'And Then There Were None' was translated into Spanish as 'Diez Negritos'. Perhaps 'Negrillo'.. - bill1111, Nov 26, 2010
2
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No, I do want to use Blackey and Me, because it is a childrens book with the narrator being a little girl, so for my purpose, I would like it to be "Me", Thanks anyways. -

It's your title, so do as you wish. Some grammarians will be offended but your intended audience appears to be those too young to be aware of the distinction. Either they will eventually learn that your title is "ungrammatical" or they won't (or they will but they won't care).

I find your implicati0n, that, because they are little children, teaching ungrammatical structures is OK/preferrable, a bit odd. (In my experience with little children, using "I' presents no problem).

In any event, do as you wish! It is most unlikely that your title will be paradigm shifting for anyone (much less little children). Children are constantly exposed to "bad" grammar. Some overcome these obstacles, most do not. However, the very fact that most do not, provides comfort/support for the ungrammatical.

updated Nov 26, 2010
edited by samdie
posted by samdie
I understand that it may be grammatically incorrect, but you have to take into factor that many famous authors (Steinbeck, Orwell), use sentence fragments and run-ons as well, and there is a movie titled "Me and Orson Welles" too. - hihihihihi, Nov 26, 2010
1
vote

It is customary to put the reference to yourself last. This is not a grammatical issue but one of usage (so as not to sound too egotistical/self-centered).

Your English sentence fragments, on the other hand, are (almost certainly) grammatically incorrect. "me" is the objective/accusative case (object of a verb/preposition) and it's very difficult to construct a proper English sentence by starting with the object. In all likelihood, "Blackey and I ..." is what you mean. You could get yourself off of the hook by, for example, saying "About Blackey and me" or "The adventures of Blackey and me" or some such.

On the other hand, using "me" as you have done is a very common mistake so you'll have lots of company.

updated Nov 26, 2010
posted by samdie
No, I do want to use Blackey and Me, because it is a childrens book with the narrator being a little girl, so for my purpose, I would like it to be "Me", Thanks anyways. - hihihihihi, Nov 25, 2010
I don't mean to offend, but what has that to do with anything? If anything, it would be nice for children to read well written books that teach them correct grammar, and not ones that reinforce their mistakes - bill1111, Nov 25, 2010
I agree Bill as someone who has helped to teach young children. :) The only occasion you could use incorrect grammer is if you were reporting something a young child had said and I would only do that if the parent or teacher were going to gently correct - FELIZ77, Nov 25, 2010
...correct them immediately after so the child listening to the story/reading the book would not be left with a wrong idea of how to speak English - FELIZ77, Nov 25, 2010
Thank for everyone's input, but this is a school assignment, so no child will ever read it and get the wrong message. Also, what about the movie Me and Orson Welles? - hihihihihi, Nov 26, 2010
The title choice also deals with my preference of syntax (Dictionary.com), because of the way the words are organized and effect of my overall purpose. The purpose? To make it sound as if a little girl is speaking. - hihihihihi, Nov 26, 2010
1
vote

I agree with Echoline, perhaps Spanish is the same as English where - 'so and so and I' is correct but 'me and him' is nasty smile

updated Nov 25, 2010
posted by Kiwi-Girl
0
votes

Concerning the distinction in English between Me and Blackey, or Blackey and I, obviously Blackey and I is proper English, but there is a very popular book/movie that came out a couple of years ago called....

Marlee and Me

alt text

I don't think that anyone had any trouble understanding what the movie was about.

updated Nov 26, 2010
posted by 001a2987
Indeed.. it clearly belongs in the horror genre! - bill1111, Nov 26, 2010
Yes, chruhlman, I agree, thanks! - hihihihihi, Nov 26, 2010
0
votes

Another thought...

I would consider converting Blackey and all names in the book to Spanish equivalents. If Spanish equivalents don't exist, I would choose nice-sounding Spanish names at random for the characters.

I don't know if Spanish people have the custom of naming their dogs after their hair color (I would imagine they do), so I don't know what the equivalent of Blackey would be. If there isn't an equivalent, I would try to find out some common Spanish names for pet dogs.

But that's just a thought, a suggestion, that's all.

updated Nov 26, 2010
posted by webdunce
Okay, since Blackie is Negrito or even Negro in Spanish, which could come across as offensive in the USA, I would try to find a very common Spanish dog name...or just leave it Blackie. - webdunce, Nov 26, 2010
Another little piece of information, I never thought people would notice or anything, so Blackey is not the actual name I am using in the book. Thanks for spending you time and effort on that though! - hihihihihi, Nov 26, 2010
0
votes

Well if you were talking about two people then mentioning first the other person it would be the best... however you're talking about an animal so my advice is mentioning yourself first...

updated Nov 24, 2010
edited by AntMexico
posted by AntMexico
ok that sounds good, thanks! - hihihihihi, Nov 24, 2010
0
votes

-- answered --

updated Nov 24, 2010
edited by pesta
posted by pesta