Translation exercise: (upper beginners and intermediate): Una privacidad inadmisible

5
votes

This text is an interesting point of view about religion. Here in Spain politicians are insisting that religion should be a private issue and not be shown in public places.

I will post the best translation on a new thread and we can have a debate about this topic.

This text is meant for upper beginners and intermediate students, everybody is welcomesmile

Written by Cardenal Ricard María Carles

Se insiste en que la religión se ha de vivir en lo privado.

Los cristianos hemos recibido de Cristo la misión de «id y anunciad el evangelio a todas las gentes». La fe no es un tesoro para guardar en la intimidad. Por su importancia para realizar plenamente a la persona, se ha de compartir con quienes carecen de ella. Cuando vivimos algo que valoramos positivamente, el corazón nos lleva a compartirlo con aquellos que amamos. San Juan, iniciando su primera carta, dice con siete verbos distintos, que: «Lo que existía desde el principio, lo que hemos “oído”, lo que hemos “visto” con nuestros ojos, lo que “contemplamos y tocaron” nuestras manos acerca de la Palabra de vida,…lo que hemos “visto y oído”, os lo “anunciamos”, para que también vosotros estéis en comunión con nosotros. Y nosotros estamos en comunión con el Padre y con su Hijo Jesucristo». Es la afirmación más autorizada de que la fe no se nos da para guardarla privadamente. Tenemos el precedente –a millares– de a quienes la proclamación de la fe les costó la vida en todo lugar y en todo tiempo. También en el nuestro. Y, ante todo, tenemos a Cristo que murió por proclamar el evangelio.

6065 views
updated FEB 21, 2010
edited by 00494d19
posted by 00494d19
mmm interesting and polemic, i think we will discuss a lot about this topic. Nice!

15 Answers

2
votes

Some are insisting that religion should be lived in private.

The Christians have received this mission: "Go and proclaim the gospel to all the people." The faith is not a treasure to keep in private. It is important for every last person to realize that it has to be shared with whoever lacks it. When we go through something that we value positively, our heart moves us to share it with those that we love.

Saint John, beginning his first Epistle, says with seven distinct verbs, that, "That which existed from the beginning, that which we have "heard", that which we have "seen" with our eyes, that which we "looked at and touched" [with] our hands concerning the Word of life-

That which we have seen and heard, we proclaim to you, so that you will be in fellowship with us. And we are in fellowship with the Father, and with his Son, Jesus Christ."

It is the most authoritative statement that the faith wasn't given to us to keep it private. We have the precedent of thousands to whom the proclamation of the faith cost them their lives, in every place and every time. Also here and now. And above all we have Christ, who died through proclaiming the gospel.

This was almost unfair since I am so familiar with this passage in John that I almost didn't have to translate it. I had to really focus to make sure I was conveying an accurate translation and not just quoting from memory.

But the parts before and after the Bible passage were much more difficult than the last exercise at this level.

updated FEB 11, 2010
posted by Goyo
Really? Well, I will have to find something easier then, I thought it was not so complicated, as this is not even near my killer threads...;)
You just love to torture me!
3
votes

Great translations, my friendsgrin

I would like to point out some difficult parts:

haber de hacer algo: deber de hacer algo

This is an old-fashioned construction, not very often used, and it means the same as deber de ...

Has de venir a las 8. Debes de venir a las 8

this writer uses it frequently, as he is referring to old principles:

se ha de vivir en lo privado.

se ha de compartir con quienes carecen de ella

Remember that constructions like:

I study English to communicate better. I am going to England to

learn...

is always translated as "para".

La fe no es un tesoro para guardar

la fe no se nos da para guardarla privadamente

os lo “anunciamos”, para que también vosotros estéis en comunión con nosotros

One more thing to remember:

When do we use de que and when que?

Es la afirmación más autorizada de que

If you can say:

de esto, it is de only.

If you can't, you must use dewink

No estoy seguro de que vaya mañana. NO estoy seguro de esto. grin

No estoy contento que me hayas mentido. No estoy contento esto. confused

I would like to discuss the matter in this thread here, if you wish to participate, you are very welcomesmile

updated FEB 14, 2010
posted by 00494d19
Any question welcome:-)
2
votes

It is said that religion should be kept private.

As Christians we have received a mission from Christ to "Go and spread the word to all the peoples." Faith is not a treasure to be guarded intimately. For a person to fully grasp its importance, it must be shared with those who lack it. When we live something that we value highly, our heart compels us to share it with those we love. Saint John, in beginning his first letter, said with seven distinct verbs that "That which existed in the beginning, that we have 'heard', that we have 'seen' with our eyes, that which we 'think and do' regarding the Word of life, ... that which we have 'seen and heard', we have 'proclaimed' to you, because you all are also in communion with us. And we are in communion with the Father and his Son Jesus Christ". Here is the most compelling affirmation that faith is not given to us so that we can keep it private. We have thousands of examples from all times and all places of people whose proclamation of faith cost them their lives. In our time, too. And, primarily, we have Christ who died to proclaim the Word.

updated FEB 14, 2010
posted by Lrtward
very nice, tward, did you think it was too difficult for upper beginners?
I had to look up a couple of words (plenamente, por ejemplo) y me costó un poco de tiempo. Entonces, no fue demasiado fácil ni difícil. Fue perfecto (para mí)
2
votes

Heidita said- Really? Well, I will have to find something easier then, I thought it was not so complicated, as this is not even near my killer threads...wink - Heidita

I would like to talk a bit about the difficulties I faced.

My first problem was in the first line-

Se insiste en que la religión se ha de vivir en lo privado.

I was not at all familiar with such a construction as se ha de vivir. I found the answer by Googling "se+ha+infinitive." I found this page with some helpful info on that. LoMasTV

The next problem-

Por su importancia

Again, that's a new construction I haven't seen. I hoped the phrase would be in the dictionary here or my printed one, but it wasn't that I could find. Googling that phrase gave me millions of hits. I read several pages and tried to get the gist of it's use by the context.

a la persona

I only got this because of familiarity with the English expression "to the man", meaning to the last man. That fit the context. I didn't have any other clues, so I went with it.

el corazón nos lleva a compartirlo

I wasn't at all sure, other than I knew where the author was coming from. Our dictionary gave me my only real basis for making the translation that I felt he was trying to say-

llevar a alguien a hacer algo -> to lead o cause somebody to do something

So I chose- "our heart moves us to share it*

se ha de compartir

Since we had a construction like this in the first line, I didn't have a problem with this. But otherwise it would have been the same situation.

También en el nuestro.

I was hung up on that for a long time! Finally I decided that the pronoun nuestro had to refer to "en todo lugar y en todo tiempo" from the previous sentence. that was my guess.

And that's just it- I felt that I was guessing through many of these parts for which I didn't have a clear answer. And that reminds me of the Killer threads. Not that this was as hard as they are, but it's like trying to solve a big mystery rather than merely looking up some words and applying some rules.

I'm sure I am speaking for many more who participated when I say that this was really a challenge for us newbies.

updated FEB 11, 2010
edited by Goyo
posted by Goyo
2
votes

It is stressed that religion must be experienced in private Christ entrusted the Christians with the mission to “ go and announce the gospel to every creature.” Faith isn’t a treasure to be kept in privacy. In order to be complete it among people, it has to be shared with the ones devoid of it. When we experience something that we value, our heart brings us to share it with the ones we love. Saint John , in the opening of his letter, says through seven different verbs that “what has existed from the beginning, what we have been hearing, what we have been seeing with our eyes, what we contemplated and touched with our hands, it was about the word of life….. what we saw and heard was announced to you , so that you as well are in communion with us. And we are in communion with Father and his son Jesus Christ. “ This is a statement that best allows saying that faith is not given to us to be kept it in privacy. We have a precedent - thousands of them – of those whose confession of faith cost them lives anywhere and anytime in the world. Also nowadays. And, above all, we have Christ who died for a gospel proclamation.

updated FEB 11, 2010
posted by bomberapolaca
Well, the subject of the passage aint' my cup of tea but gave it a try anyway...
2
votes

This is my best attempt...

It is said that religion should be lived in private:

Christians have received from Christ the mission to "go and proclaim the gospel to all nations". Faith is not a treasure to kept in privacy. In order for its importance to be fully realized ,it must be shared with those who lack it. When we live with something we value positively, the heart leads us to share with those we love. St. John starts his first letter, speaking with seven distinct verbs:

"That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon and our hands have handled, of the Word of life ...

what we have "seen and heard", I tell you "declare" that you also may have fellowship with us. And our fellowship is with the Father and His Son Jesus Christ. It is the most authoritative statement that faith is not given to save privately. We have the precedent of thousands-in all times and places,of whom the proclamation of faith cost them their life. Also in ours, and above all, we have Christ who died in order to proclaim the Gospel.

updated FEB 11, 2010
posted by Nicole-B
2
votes

Some insist that religion should be lived in private.

Christians received from Christ the mission to proclaim his message to all people. Faith is not a treasure to keep private. Because of its importance to becoming a fully realized person, it should be shared with those who lack it. When we live something that we value positively, the heart leads to share it with those we love. Saint John, starting his first letter, says with seven distinct verbs that, “What existed from the beginning, what we have heard, what we have seen with our eyes, what we have contemplated and touched with our hands concerning the Word of Life . . . what we have seen and heard, we announce to you, so that you may be in communion with us. And we are in communion with the Father and his Son, Jesus Christ.” This is the most authoritative statement that faith is not given to us to keep private. We have the precedent, by the thousands, of those whose proclamation of faith cost them their lives in every place and at all times. Also in ours. And, above all, we have Christ who died for proclaiming the gospel.

updated FEB 11, 2010
posted by 008f2974
2
votes

Here's my attempt. I nearly gave up after the title!

Some insist that religion should be expressed privately

A Christians we have received the mission from Christ to “go and spread the gospel to all people.” Faith is not a treasure to be kept to ourselves. For its value is fully realized when a person shares it with those who lack it. When we live something that we value positively, the heart encourages us to share it with those whom we love. St. John, in the introduction to his first letter, says with seven different verbs, that “what existed since the beginning,” “what we have “heard,” what we have “seen” with our eyes, what we have “considered and touched” with our hands about the Word of Life… what we have “seen and heard,” “we announce” to you, in order for you to be in communion with us. And we are in communion with the Father and with the Son Jesus Christ.” This is the most authoritative affirmation of faith that it is not given to us to keep to ourselves. We have the precedent – by the thousands – from those in all places and all times, whose proclamation of faith cost them their lives. In addition to ours. And, above all we have Christ who died to proclaim the gospel.

updated FEB 11, 2010
posted by LaBurra
2
votes

They Insist That Religion Be Lived in Private. We Christians have received from Christ the mission of "go and announce the Word to all the people". Faith is not a treasure to be kept intimately (privately?). For its importance to appear plainly to the person, it has to be shared with those who lack of it. When we live something that we positively value, the heart carries us to share it with those we love. St. John, starting his first letter, says with seven distinct verbs that '"that which exists from the bginning, that which we have 'heard', that which we have 'seen' with our own eyes, that which we have 'contemplated and touched' with our hands near the Word of Life, that which we have 'seen and heard', 'we announce' it to you, for this also you are in communion with us. And we are in communion with the Father and his Son, Jesus Christ. " It is the most authoritative affirmation that faith is not given to us in order to guard it privately. We have the precedent - the thousands - of those for whom the proclamation of faith cost them their lives, in every place and every time. Also, in our lives, and before all, we have Christ, who died to proclaim the Word.

updated FEB 11, 2010
edited by DR1960
posted by DR1960
Your text was flying off of the page, just edited the format so that it could be read :)
some missing pieces - I'll have to come back later to fix them.
Thanks Izanoni - the font changed mid-sentence, not sure why.
1
vote

A Free Translation grin

Some politicians claim that religion is a private affair and should be practised that way. As Christians we have received from Christ the mission to proclaim the gospel to all people. Faith is not a treasure to be kept to oneself. If its value is to be fully embraced it should be lovingly shared with everyone. When one practices positive values ones heartfelt desire is to share them amongst those we love.

St. John at the beginning of his first epistle emphasises the six senses and writes “ That which existed from the beginning, we have heard, we have seen with our own eyes, have contemplated and touched with our own hands, concerns the Word of life,...that which we have seen and heard we pay testimony to so that you may be in communion with us as we are in communion with the Father and his son Jesus Christ.

This is the most authoritative affirmation we have that faith is not to be kept to ourselves. We find precedence in the thousands whose proclamation of the faith has cost them their lives everywhere and throughout time. This still happens today. Beyond all we have Christ who died for preaching the word

updated FEB 12, 2010
edited by lagartijaverde
posted by lagartijaverde
good job, bird, well done:-)
1
vote

People insist that religion has to be kept private.

As Christians we have received Christ’s mission to “Go and spread the word to the world.” Faith is not a treasure to keep to ourselves. Because of its importance in making us whole, we have to share with whoever is lacking. When we live through something that we value positively, our heart leads us to share it with those that we love. St. John, beginning his first epistle, said with seven distinct verbs, that:

That which existed from the beginning, which we have “heard,” which we have “seen” with our eyes, which we consider and our hands have "touched” concerning the Word of life…That which we have “seen and heard,” we proclaim unto you, so that you might also share fellowship with us. And we are in fellowship with the Father and with his Son, Jesus Christ.

This is the most authorized affirmation that our faith was not given to us to keep privately within ourselves. We have the precedent –in the thousands– throughout time and space, whose proclamations of faith cost them their lives. And in our own as well. And, above all, we have Christ who died for preaching the gospel.

updated FEB 11, 2010
edited by Izanoni1
posted by Izanoni1
0
votes

3). (expresa obligación)

• haber de hacer algo -> to have to do something

• has de estudiar más -> you have to study more

The most common usage of this, I believe, is formal. When a doctor tells a patient, "you need to take 2 doses a day", I always say, "Hay que tomar 2 dosificaciones diario". I don't believe it is that old fashioned, I believe it just sounds more formal than, "you need to" "you have to", but conveys the same idea. Maybe, more impersonal, as well, "It is necessary to" is probably the best translation, or maybe in literature, se ha de compartir = we must share or it must be shared.

Why is haber used with de here, but used with "que" in other occassions?

updated FEB 21, 2010
edited by pilipina
posted by pilipina
0
votes

Thanks for participating,, everybody < I will leave the intermediate challenges to chappari, he obviously does a better job at this.

I hope you do them too. I think you do a great job!

updated FEB 12, 2010
posted by Goyo
I believe chaparri's threads are more appreciated, I will leave him to it, thanks for participating-
0
votes

Thanks for participating,, everybodygrin

I will leave the intermediate challenges to chappari, he obviously does a better job at this.

updated FEB 12, 2010
edited by 00494d19
posted by 00494d19
0
votes

I was not at all familiar with such a construction as se ha de vivir. I found the answer by Googling "se+ha+infinitive."

I know exactly what you mean Greg....I couldn't for the life of me figure out this construction (thanks so much for the link, by-the-way). I ended up looking up haber in our dictionary and found this:

3). (expresa obligación)

• haber de hacer algo -> to have to do something

• has de estudiar más -> you have to study more

• siempre has de ser tú el que se queje -> you always have to be the one to complain

I'm sure I am speaking for many more who participated when I say that this was really a challenge for us newbies.

You can speak for me on this...If it wasn't for the fact that I was already somewhat familiar with the quoted passage, I might not have finished this. red face

updated FEB 12, 2010
posted by Izanoni1
so it was in the dictionary!! I did not know